Call for tax on all online shopping

ISLANDERS who shop online should pay GST on all goods, whatever their cost, to help pay for public services and protect local retailers, according to the president of the Chamber of Commerce.

Could we be made to pay tax on all of our internet shopping?
Could we be made to pay tax on all of our internet shopping?

ISLANDERS who shop online should pay GST on all goods, whatever their cost, to help pay for public services and protect local retailers, according to the president of the Chamber of Commerce.

At a time when St Helier is losing several high street shops and with more and more goods being bought over the internet, David Warr believes it is time for the States to review the level at which the five per cent tax is applied to imported goods.

Comments for: "Call for tax on all online shopping"

Rosie

Not fair on those that cannot physically get to the shops. Again it is hitting the pocket of the ordinary man instead of the multi corporations or millionaires who can afford it better

Conrad

Good point as thanks to Sandpiper and their efforts to bring in a high street ruining UK chain every few months very few local retaillers are left. And.as a bonus tourists are lost as St Helier becomes more and more like Nottingham. It'll be Wilkonsons next instead of the Market.

the thin wallet

totaly agree. even if i paid gst on all i imported , i would still be ahead .

why would i walk to town or pay to park to go to town.

un less its a item that i must see and feel or need right now .

i will be clicking .

most of my purchases are after the working day is over .

the high street is and will change .

i do not a buy a coffee either

Darius Pearce

A business will succeed in spite of government and not because of it, what are you doing asking for government to distort the free market to protect your interests?

It is businesses that needed to change ten years ago.

The internet shopping phenomena is now some 14 years old and has passed its peak growth phase, you should be preparing for the post-internet phase where high street retailing becomes once again the cheaper option as all the fixed costs are covered within the internet sales margin and not the shop sales margin.

As one of the few Jersey businesses who seems to have adapted to the new reality, whose turnover is still increasing year on year, despite the recession, the internet and all the other excuses that failing businesses seem to be using, what you have been missing out on for 14 years is a simple change in focus - stop targeting Jersey customers.

Target online sales and then sell your products cheaper still in store (it costs a lot to post stuff overseas so why not pass that saving onto local customers), for the truly price savvy Jersey buyers.

Jersey was never a viable marketplace, there are not enough customers, and the few there are no longer have enough money to spend after the constant tax rises of the past ten years.

The governments constant efforts to stop tourists from coming to Jersey is the killing joke as all local businesses depended on them to be viable since the second world war.

Stop going to Chamber of Commerce lunches and actually do some work on the shop floor yourself, and you will improve customer service.

The government is determined to stay the course to economic catastrophe, they have not even slowed down the rate of growth of expenditure, there is no way to stop them.

So you simply have to side-step them, base your business entirely on overseas sales and any local business you get is an extra.

Stop wasting money on staff and advertising to service the local client base, it's not like shops need to be open longer than 11 till 3 anyway. I only have a shop because the manufacturers will only supply you if you do.

Jersey customers will soon have even less money to spend and will be an even less viable marketplace. GST will be 20% in no time and then GST will be levied on ever more imported goods anyway.

So how can it possibly make sense to target an ever diminishing market, when there is a whole wide world out there?

Adapt or die. When you have caught on to the changes you should have made a decade ago, then you can start thinking about the changes which now need to be made as the internet starts to decline as an avenue for sales as more and more manufacturers are pulling out of the internet high street (eBay and Amazon) because they can see the way these outlets damage their perceived brand value.

And Conrad, the States of Jersey are only the trustees of the public markets, they do not own them, they merely administer them. Read the 1885 law, they belong to the people, not the government.

Any attempt to change this is a breach of trust.

the thin wallet

ah the days of the holidaymakers . all afforable , wages went miles .

the life style was so good that is was difficult to say who was working or who was on holiday.

sadly never coming back.

i will be back shopping localy when wages double .

Fed Up

Well put Mr Pearce

ripper

Yeah

You are the guy selling expensive jewellery cleaner in jersey who is going on the amazon reviews and slagging off better stuff at cheaper prices

Darius Pearce

I'm afraid you must be looking at a different Amazon to me.

#1 best selling product in the category you name is sold by Nigel Pearce & Son, Jewellers in Jersey, at the lowest price on Amazon.

#21 best selling product in the category you name is sold by Nigel Pearce & Son, Jewellers in Jersey at nearly half the price Amazon themselves are selling it for.

(rankings can change but that is where they stand at this moment)

If I choose to express my opinion on the relative quality of products for the benefit of other shoppers on Amazon, then it is simply because I have more experience of these products than most people.

I resent your implication that I would make a false statement, if I thought another product was better then I would simply supply that product instead.

I only buy to sell what, in my considered opinion, I believe to be the best combination of quality and value.

I have put the effort in and made an actual comparison between products before reaching a conclusion.

My customers therefore do not need to do all that work for themselves.

I feel free to share my considered opinion with other people and indeed am actively encouraged to by Amazon.

Now what was the point you wished to make?

adder

some people dont listen to good advice thats why we are all doomed

Andre

Slapping a tax on internet shoppers is surely the wrong way round here. Mr Warr should be focusing on rents charged for town shops. In the 1980's UK chains were desperate to open up here, and it was they who had the financial clout to pay spiralling rents. The big chains are struggling now, partially because of the very rental levels they once helped to inflate. The Chamber of Commerce should be campaigning for lower, sustainable rentals. That would do far more for local shops than the hugely unpopular tax they are proposing. Lower overheads would allow them to be more competitive with the internet.

And by the way, alternative shopping to the High street existed long before the internet. Catalogue shopping has been around for decades. Those companies initiated telephone ordering a long time ago. There is nothing new about this sort of off-island retailing.

Poorer by the day

I totally agree, if rents were cheaper then maybe retailers can drop their prices and compete with online stores. GST wont make the price any cheaper just give States more money in tax!!

James Wiley

Darius you forgot to add the biggest advantage of your business model...

When Jersey goes under you can leave the island AND take your business with you. Unlike those who are invested in immovable assets.

A candidate for the Jersey Enterprise Awards.

Luigi

Very well said, and beautifully explained.

The future

There are no physical or mental conditions which make your purchases GST exempt. The way we shop has changed the collection of taxes needs to keep up with changes in the way society behaves.

It will not help local retailers much but it has the potential to help raise badly needed tax money.

Nobody likes paying more tax, this will not reverse the decline of the high street, the longer we wait to implement this the more money Jersey let's slip away.

adder st helier

This man is more of a fool than I first thought he has just sank his coffee business

The average working mum

I am an average working mother with all the everyday stresses that thousands of women like me have to deal with. I very rarely go to town because a) I don't have the time, b) by the time I find a parking space I have to return home/ to work/to pick up children etc and c) if I get to a shop they often don't have what I wanted. So to save my time I shop when I can online which gives me more precious time to be with my family. It's not about cheaper prices online it is convenience in this ever quickening and stressful world. It is just the way things are and now we shall be penalised by increasing the costs of what we buy! This won't put me off as I still won't have the time but I will now be also out of pocket! Thanks for thinking of the everyday people Mr Warr!

I Pasdenom

Rosie,

"Not fair on those that cannot physically get to the shops. Again it is hitting the pocket of the ordinary man instead of the multi corporations or millionaires who can afford it better"

Completely wrong Rosie, why if you can't go to a local shop should you not still pay GST?

If you called the local shop and they delivered it to you would you expect not to pay GST?

Channel Highlander

Greed Greed and More Greed... you just dont know when to stop!

I Pasdenom

Channel Highlander,

"Greed Greed and More Greed..."

How is GST 'greed'?

Are you talking about the funding of those greedy nurses?

bob73

You can stick 5/10 even 20% on all goods coming in, It would still make them cheaper than the High Street.

Pip Clement

The online discounts are so big it will not make any difference at all and the cost of collection on cheap items will be huge, together with all the work that Customs will have to do.

cancer

I'm sure Mr Warr is doing all he can to support local business. The problem is that the World has moved on, far and fast, and protectionist measures like this aren't going to solve the problem.

I went to Town last month to buy a new "small appliance" - it was £125. I went home and bought from Amazon at £87. With Mr Warr's 5% GST it would have been £91.35. Guess what, I would still have bought it from Amazon.

The unfortunate reality is that the "Universal High Street" is rapidly becoming a thing of the past. That is of no comfort to the retailers, but a simple recognition that the Internet, fast/efficient courier services and the advantages of bulk purchase by major distributors will win every time. It's evolution, and it's hard.

jerseyboy

Cancer I disagree.

"I’m sure Mr Warr is doing all he can to support local business. "

Mr Warr is busy slating the general public for not supporting the local economy but, where's his support for the local person as he fills his shops with staff from Eastern Europe.

It works both ways Mr Warr. Many of us simply wont support the likes of you unless you support us.

sideline

well said m8

Islander

Who would benefit if the cost of collecting tax on low priced items is greater than the tax itself?

Scrutineer

It would increase employment or overtime in Maritime House!

Shopper

I think Mr Warr needs to realise that it is not my responsibility to protect greedy local retailers who can't cope with the concept of healthy competition. The guise of 'shipping/import costs' doesn't wear anymore. A certain clothing chain over here adds 50p or £1 to every single item on sale in thier store on top of the full price which includes VAT - what's being done to protect the consumer?

Scrutineer

If all the other retailers are struggling so much, I find it very interesting how Waterstones in King Street survives. They charge the cover price, which is the UK price, plus GST (I think that there is no VAT on books in the UK). So, in theory, they are charging exactly the same as in the UK. Perhaps, there is a catch, but I do not know what it is. So if they can get the books in, and sell them, and run a viable business, why cannot other people?

dave

has david warr ever heard the expression 'doing a ratner' ?

Jersey Lady

Oh my god!!! I cannot believe I am reading this.

I am a large lady & cannot buy my clothes over here, as Evans left & the the large ladies part in New Look.

So can somebody explain to me how else I am supposed to buy my clothes.

There are a lot of men & women who do not have the shops to buy their clothes in. This is totally unfair.

And I would certainly not be & could not afford to pay £70 for a jumper and the crazy prices of these stores, as that is all we have left, and u wonder why everytime u walk past their is not a sole in them.

Bo

Although I resent this, even with the 5% GST added, it will still be cheaper to shop online.

And you really think Mr Warr any of this money will be ploughed back to the retailers, well think again.

Also, I do believe those retailers going are UK chains, so what difference will this make to rip off Jersey

Ridiculous

Went into Mr Warr's little shop, Coopers, the other day. I needed something urgently so ended up having to pay his extortionate prices. Something that would have cost £7 on the internet was £9.95 in his shop. Even worse, I was then subjected to an EXTRA charge as I wanted to pay under £10 by debit card which is absolutely ludicrous.

Clearly Mr Warr does not feel the need to make his own shop competitive but instead wishes to hinder his competitors. I will never use his shop again and I wonder how many others are put off from lining his coffers after his repeated ridiculous outbursts.

pauper

The mark up price on Mr Warr's coffee must be huge considering most businesses are struggling, and yet he has opened a new coffee shop on the waterfront which must demand high rents?

Are we as the customers the only ones using the internet to buy?

D.Smedley

This week i bought a new modem wireless router locally as I needed it urgently. Computer shop at JEC no stock - irritating. Computer shop in town £79 bought it. Later that day checked online to see how much I had been ripped off by and amazon.com price including free delivery £43.32! - irriated and angry. I knew it was going to be more expensise locally but this is really taking the p*ss. So even with this proposal of 5% GST on everything purchased online the savings will remain immense online. Moral of the storey, ''To survive local buy online'.

Anne

why the hell should we pay gst on low priced items? is it our fault they are going under no if they did not charge extortionate prices we would not need to shop online. what about the elderly who cannot get out it is so easy to shop online and most of the time the products are se a lot better and cheaper.. why should the states keep trying to get more and more money out of us..i should imagine because they are on such good wages they can afford to shop here and pay the gst!! every day there is something else they try to take from us!!!!

TheMoaningOldBugger

The reason people buy from the Internet is price and service. Jersey retailers Must reduce prices, provide a good service or get out of the business. If there rents are too high, tough luck they have to hit back at the landlord and get a reduction. Also customers are fed up of paying to park, when they can find a space, fed up of poor service and fed up of paying high prices and fed up of waiting 8 weeks for a sofa to be delivered...

I suggest DAVID WARR and his mob look at what they are doing and not take the easy option and following Teflon boy with easy options......

My Opinion

Adding GST will not stop me from buying online. The reasons i dont shop in St Helier are:

1. Lack of parking when i want to shop.

2. Lack of parking near the shops i would use.

3. Parking charges.

4. Damages to my car in Multi-story carparks.

5. Lack of choice in shops.

6. Overpriced goods(some 20-30%)

7. Nothing seems to be in stock.

8. Lack of Customer Service.

Pj

Spot on my opinion,

Further to add, they rearly have the item you want, or a clue to show you how it would work, so you go home and google then order.

Shards

So that would be reasons 7 and 8 then! You 'rearly' need to pay more attention Pj.

booger

Agree, there is poor choice in the high street, poor service with staff seemingly put out having to deal customers. Prices are stupidly over the top most of the time and I cannot remember the last time I felt I had found bargain in a local shop. In some of the bigger UK retailers found in Jersey they actually encourage you to use the online part of their business if they do not have what you want.

Jerseybean

Wake up and smell the coffee Mr Warr,So you think adding 5% tax is going to save town retailers,Not when people get 20% vat knocked off before it is sent.The only way the retailer can survive is cutting his net profit and when did HMV and Blockbuster etc become local shops.To me a local shop employes locals and is not part of a UK chain.Harsh but true in my eyes

The Jersey Bull

This only proves that David Warr president of our local Chamber of Commerce is no more that a leftie liberal collectivist reared on the socialist economic slagheap of the nanny state.

It also shows he has no understanding of the free market, free enterprise system. To hell with the town traders when they say that they cannot compete. If people can go online, shop and buy at the best competitive retail price and have the order shipped and delivered to their doorstep, then more power to them!

Consider the fact that If the customer, after having paid the manufacturer’s online retail price can have the product delivered for less, then why can’t a local trader, who buys in bulk, often at a wholesale discount price, offer and deliver the same product into the island for the same price or less? The answer is pure selfish greed.

Because we are as an island community bounded by the beach and cannot drive twenty miles or so to find a better completive price, the exploitive practise of monopoly and the dishonest practice of price fixing has been allowed to blossom and grow unchecked in this island to the point where it has become an accepted local tradition to which our politicians have long turned a blind eye. Well it’s time to stop this evil practise and allow the free market to truly balance the commercial books.

The right to engage in free unencumbered commerce is an inherent Common Law Right. It is not some statute privilege given by government, lying politicians or corporate lobbyist in return for a couple of cheap votes. This right to freely engage in commerce numbers among those inherent rights with which we are endowed by our Creator.

If local traders cannot compete then they should pack up and move to some other nanny state, where perhaps they are paid, at someone’s else’ expense, to get out of bed in the morning - and take Mr. Warr with them, rather than asking the government to raise more taxes to subsidise their greed and uncompetitive work ethic at the cost of an already financially stressed out island population.

roombay42

I don't know why you only pick on retailers. For instance, there's no competition amongst lawyers and you can't shop online for one of them.

Gk

More taxes does not work.

What's the cost to monitor and deal with everything coming into jersey.

Has he any idea the logistics to work such a stupid idea?

Are we in communist china or jersey?

James Wiley

China can only dream of having a bureaucracy as large as ours.

Not even the Soviet Union which collapsed under the weight of its own bureaucracy ever managed to have as many people working for government as Jersey does.

the thin wallet

ha , ha , lol.

"never has so few being administered by so many ".

James Mac

What Mr Warr is proposing is discriminatory behaviour against online retailers. Local retailers have systems designed to collect GST at point of sale: most e-businesses do not (some have a hard enough job working out that we are outside the VAT zone). This would mean that the only way to collect GST would be either to stop parcel deliveries altogether and have everyone collect from Post HQ, or else have posties coming and demanding 50p or whatever for the GST before handing over the package. After the first half dozen posties are mugged, deliveries would probably be stopped anyway.

The familiar arguments will be rehearsed: that too many local retailers don't keep the stock, can't be bothered to source what the customer wants, or cheat the customer by charging GST on top of VAT-inclusive prices - not that anyone is proposing to do anything about the latter act of retail fraud.

But there may be other ways to skin the rabbit. It's worth taking a look at a report published <a href="http://www.forbes.com/sites/singularity/2013/01/28/corporate-tax-2-0-why-france-and-the-world-need-a-new-tax-system-for-the-digital-age/" rel="nofollow">here</a>: this is someone thinking through the realities of how e-business is different.

matt

There is no ethical reason not to charge GST on all imported items regardless of their value.

Most of the things we order over the internet are luxury items like books, clothes, DVDs and alike. Paying an extra 5℅ GST still makes them good value compared locally, so would make an excellent way of raising extra revenue.

GordonP

Clothes and books are luxury items? I think not!

the thin wallet

matt should see how how far he gets if he was to walk down the street naked .

clothes are a legal requirement .

however the "naked rambler leads" the way .

Dan

Well yes, but consider this,

If you paid a Customs clerk say £20,000 /yr

and if the bulk of non gst imports are as you say DVDs , books etc ,lets say they are worth on average £10 , so 50p tax / item at 5%.

The £20k/yr clerk would have to process 40000 of these items per year to break even, that's 1 every 2 seconds in a 50 week working year........ I'm thinking this is simply going to cost the taxpayer money, but then again since when have the politicians worried about that?

matt

Simply do as the UK does. The seller has to pre pay the GST. If an item arrives without prepayment then it is detained by jersey customs. Then purchaser must pay the GST or an admin charge of £15, which ever is the greater.

Thirtysomething

Well, that is just silly.

I purchase a sheet of stickers online for my daughter for £1.50, including postage and packaging. It is sent in a plain envelope.

You say I should pay £15 to receive it?

My friend sends me a birthday card from the UK, The Post office cannot tell that this is any different from the above package, So, I must pay £15 to receive it?

What is your problem with GST? Why do you want the less well off in this island to have even less money?

NB

Great idea....so....who pays HMRC to collect said pre-paid GST and handle the payment of it to Jersey Customs? Or perhaps you think the Post Office and HMRC would do this for free?

What you have suggested their would effectively mean Jersey becoming a black listed destination for every small internet retailer (including those whose products you cannot buy locally) and in all likelihood large retailers like Amazon as well.

An ill thought out, short sighted suggestion if ever i've seen one.

roombay42

NB: Do HMRC pay our post office to collect their VAT?

Harry

Matt, are books and clothes luxury items where you come from? I would consider them basics unless we are to be both naked and uneducated in the future.

James Mac

Books and some clothes (children's, at least) are <b>not</b> regarded as luxuries by the EU - they are exempt from VAT.

But then Jersey people think that marine diesel for their gin palaces is not a luxury - after all, it's exempt from GST.

Thirtysomething

There is a clear ethical reason for preventing a charge on all imported items, or have you forgotten?

When GST was first introduced, there was a proposition to charge only 1.5% instead of the original 3%.

This was rejected for the reason that the tax would not cover the cost of running the tax. So we can conclude that at least half the income went into running the tax when introduced.

With the change from 3% to 5%, it means that a third of the income from GST is used to run the tax.

By charging GST on all imported goods, this will require far greater expenses in collecting this tax, more staff to collect the tax, larger building, more managers, more accountants. More money spent.

This would increase the cost to run the tax, from this proposal...

Tt would mean GST would have to increase.

As GST affects people inverse proportionally to income, it has a greater affect on people, the less well off someone is.

So in short, Matt,

You want to Tax the Poor more than the wealthy!

Because you don’t understand the ethical reasons for not applying GST to all imported items?

Parktown Prawn

Matt

Try educating yourself!

They do not NEED to make extra revenue.....they already get enough!

What they NEED to do is STOP WASTING the revenue they already get!

Comprendez!

Mrbean

president of the Chamber of Commerce should go boil his head.

if Jersey retailers sold items at a reasonable price then maybe more people would shop locally, we are not stupid and why should we pay over the odds??

Suzanne

Who is this joker ! Be more competitive and provide a better service and retailers might fare better !

Orangebusdriver

In some way I can see where he is coming from......but the hard facts are that for too long the high street shops in town have been shafting the shoppers and now they have voted with their feet and shopped on line. I can avoid the hassle of going into town, being green and using less fuel to pollute the environment, having to find finding a parking space etc etc. Shopping has changed due to the net and more shops will go to the wall.simpe fact. Should the retailers here operate on line from warehouses avoiding the obviously huge rents, I have no idea and then being able to compete with the uk prices., due to less overheads. For goodness sake I can get cat food cheaper on the net delivered to my door from the uk . Makes no sense. You also now have the added situation that families are being extremely careful on their household expenditure as they do not know what's around the corner , compounding the issue of less money being spent. Go on charge gst on all things imported , doesn't bother me it is still cheaper than shopping here. Sorry, but true !!! Times a changing. I still love the island :-)

cam

or the States could stop giving tenders to UK companies who bring in they labour and don't pay Jersey Tax, social and probably get a refund on GST, instead allowing a local company to employ more people therefore contributing more to Tax, Social and GST and then there are the building companies that get a refund on all the GST they incur whether or not it is for a new build or just doing old jobs -

Jub

No, no, no, no.

David Warr get your beak out. Increasing parking charges in town in one news article, then calling for taxes on ALL online shopping with the other, both screwing the customer.

I will be avoiding your coffee shops now David. I'll buy my coffee online. No Parking fees, no GST. Enjoy Mr Warr.

Michael

Jub, I propose we all boycott Mr Warr Coffee shop outlets, I for one will not set foot in his shops or cafe again!!! by the way you can buy coffee online through Amazon much cheaper then local shops. Mr Warrs comments are designed to hurt a very large percentage of the population of Jersey, we really should boycott his shops

Taxpayer

How dare Mr Warr tell me what taxes I must pay,who does he think he is,that is the last time I will ever buy Coopers Coffee,not that I ever did because I buy it online from Amazon at a much more affordable price,I spend my money where I chose to spend it,and 5 per cent as everyone knows is neither here nor there when you take in the 50 per cent plus discount on most goods on the Internet.Does Mr Warr honestly expect people to give that kind of discount back to local shopkeepers.I did not see or hear of Mr Warr, Chamber of Commerce,policing the shops that charge VAT+GST,get into the real world

One world Wally

Protectionism; that old chestnut. I would have thought Mr Warr would have the intelligence to know that these policies never work.

You can make very significant savings by shopping on line even when you do pay GST. These savings are for many, the difference between buying the product or not.

If people cannot afford to purchase goods from Jersey retailers then slapping GST on low value imports is not going to find the money to pay double the price locally.

There are local retailers who do operate a fair pricing policy; The Apple Shop and Seedee Jons charge the UK price for an iPad, less VAT plus GST, now you cannot say fairer than that. Both companies are small retailers and have to make a profit.

If they can do it Mr Warr why can't the rest of your membership.

We are hearing quite a lot from Mr Warr recently what's the betting he is winding himself for a try for a seat in the States?

the future

I have been saying this since GST was introduced, make the sender pre pay the GST or else have a minimum charge to cover the cost of administration.

The trade deficit is becoming increasingly toxic and soon we will have effectively exported all our money.

An island of internet shoppers without work is not a great place to live.

tracy

t they be asking theirsleves why people buy online first, its because they are cheaper and more choice if the shops in town made the effort to be more competive and also employ staff that are more helpful at the day of the its comes back to money and the states are greedy people dont have loads of money to waste and if they can find at cheaper we will

GS2

It would still be a hell of a lot cheaper to buy on line even if you do add GST as a lot of retailers charge over 100% than buying on line & I have personal experience of this many many times.

bella

If you think folk will stop shopping on line,you can think again!

If the retailers were not so greedy we would gladly shop here,but most of you are way over the top and even charge the English VAT on top of your high prices.

I will carry on shopping on-line regardless.

Better service, better choice, better prices

and better communication

Shopper

Town shops are missing the point here, it will still be cheaper to buy on-line even with the GST added and more choice.

Sorry will continue to buy on-line until the retailers wake up and sort out their pricing

Rob Edwards

Oh dear, our local retailers just don't get it

It's not just GST ( nevertherless, why don't they protest against this unfair tax ? )

It's also :-

Too many shops effectively including UK VAT in their "Jersey prices"

Enormous range of product choice..and price

Swift delivery.

I'm afraid that it's probably too late to persuade Jersey shoppers to stop using internet purchases.

Bean (not around the world)

I am even more determined to shop online now. Further more, we all agreed in the office today to stop using his coffee shop every day.

Gary Castle

Strange how no one called for this when Jersey fulfilment companies benefited from supplying goods to the UK without being subject to VAT.

I doubt 5 % will force shoppers back into local shops. It will just create more money for the States and resentment towards local businesses. Such tom foolery will also most likely result in those handling online goods when they arrive in Jersey loosing their jobs.

Poor effort Mr Warr. Try harder. Spend a bit of time making town shopping more attractive by opposing parking price increases and the like. Or might that be too much like hard work and upset someone "important"?

This is my personal opinion and you are ofcousre welcome to disagree.

Nick

why don't tax the fresh air , or the sea , or why not the fact that we are walking....

if we can get things less then half price on retailers, why somebody have to come with this idea ? is going to help who ?

Simple Economics

What a statement to make for the President of the Chamber of Commerce, simple economics makes it cost prohibitive to collect taxes from the first penny spent. Jersey Customs set the dominimus at £240 as it is financially unviable to collect taxes at under £12 (£240 x 5% = £12).

Therefore if you collect GST from the first penny spent, it will cost the States MORE to collect it than the amount collected. Furthermore it will be inflationary on ALL imports including those of the local retailers as the number of detained consignments will rise circa 40-50% the cost born by the freight / courier agents to administer this will be passed on by way of a price increase to ALL customers, this making it more costly to ship to the Island for ALL.

Sometimes I really despair of the short sightedness of some of the people in power on this Island of ours

James Mac

Jersey Customs set the dominimus at £240

sp x3 <i>de minimis</i>

but your point is spot-on.

James Wiley

Actually the de minimis is £12 (being the minimum value of GST they will collect) - which means as the GST rate goes up, the value of the goods goes down.

At 3% it was £400, at 5% it is £240, at 10% it will be £120 and at 20% it will be £60 (20% of £60 being £12).

And that is 20% of the value of the goods and the value of the postage.

Interestingly enough were we to calculate GST properly then for each 99p item the GST should be 4p, so if you buy 20 items at 99p then you should pay 80p in GST.

Taxes are always rounded down because it is unlawful for the government to collect more than is owed.

However most companies charge it on the total so 19.80 works out to be 99p GST charged.

The whole point of 99p pricing is that the consumer and the retailer are making a saving in tax charged, but Jersey businesses can't be bothered to bill properly.

Trolololol

"protect local retailers"

Stop charging so much. Maybe people won't go online?

Was only a matter of time.

Lord Haw Haw

Ridiculous suggestion. This would take any army of civil servants to run. All mr Warr wants is an absolute monopoly over shoppers so that prices can increase further in order to fund greedy shopkeepers lifestyles. Lower your prices and people will come to you!

sickofthestates

This angers me so much!!!!! its not about protecting the locals shops at all about greed and the states getting more money!!!! I only ever shop online if I can not get what I need locally so i will still have to shop on line but it will be more expensive leaving me less money to put in the ecnomoy locally. The states wont give any of the money back to the locals shop but keep it for themselves. It just garbage saying thats why they are doing it!!!!! This island is going to the pots!!!

The Nock

David Warr, HOW DARE YOU! This is disgusting. Instead of worrying about finding new ways of fleecing the public why not assist by suggesting constructive ways to reduce the cost of living in the island so that people will feel they don't have shop online to save money. Chamber of Comerce.......again.....Chamber......of........Comerce....................COMERCE!

jonny

Here we go again. Warr really does not get it.

How many more times - it is not the 5% that causes people to buy elsewhere - it is the massive price variance. Even when 20% UK Vat is included, items are STILL cheaper online than local shops in so many instances.

The JEP article was almost satirical when it referred to islanders 'abusing' the system by ordering day to day items online instead of in local shops. Oh... the cheek of it.

jerseythepartiesover

I will not bother me if they did, it will still be 50% less online even with gst on top. Prob cost more I think to collect even if they brought it in. If Jersey shops did not rip us off they would not be in the mess they find themselves in now. End off.

J G

Oh Mr Warr - how you do NOT live in the real world! Why of why do you think people buy from the likes of Amazon and other on-line shopping sites? Well, let me tell you. It is because of greedy Jersey retailers who price people out of buying locally - simples!

If I could not buy a lot of items from Amazon, and that includes simple things like presents for my grandchildren to every day items like toilet paper, washing powder etc. I would not be able to buy them at all, and furthermore I will NOT buy them at the inflated prices inflicted on us locally.

Get your own house in order Mr Warr, or even better I will challenge you to a meeting with me to see if you could manage as the ordinary man in the street has to (courtesy business people like yourself) with the over inflated prices here. When you see what it is like in the REAL world, maybe you would realise why companies like Amazon are a lifesaver for some.

Please do not be so petty as to deny us the de minimus level of £240 which in real terms to you is nothing. To those that struggle it is a lifeline. If you cannot see this crawl back to your coffee shop which I would never give patronage to.

Stan

I am surprised it took him so long to call for such a protectionist measure.

s

And you seriously think that adding a 5% tax will stop us using the internet and shop locally, your mad. I save probably between 20% to 50% on everything I buy on the internet, from light bulbs, to CD,s to cameras and TV's. 5% tax wont stop me buying a single thing on the internet. When Jersey retailers charge a fair price I might shop locally EG Gant clothing in De Gruchys is priced exactly the same as the UK.

midge

those greedy, greedy parasites that run, ruin jersey are at it again this is a disgraceful idea and i hope they don't achieve it

What ?

It will just cost more to monitor, collect and pay people to ensure a fair system.

The reason it was limited to a relatively high amount f £250 was because the work involved, even at that level, was just about manageable to make it cost effective.

It's all well and good in theory, but if it costs more to police than money it brings in, the what's the point ?

Paul

Yeah you greedy so and so...just want people to shop locally and get ripped off...

Fed Up

Is Mr Warr for real? The shop retailers in town have been greedy and over charged for far too long and are now getting what they deserve.

I have been told by several when asked if the town shop would match the internet they told me to shop on line.

That says it all.

Cynic

PROTECT LOCAL RETAILERS??!?! WAS THAT IN ALL SERIOUSNESS TOUTED AS A REASON?!? SERIOUSLY? Absolute and utter madness. Retailers need to protect themselves, adjust their business models, do some market research and actually do some work. Let's not pander to lazy, incompetent retail outlet owners and protect them by edging out their competition with taxation instead of them actually pulling a finger out.

Online shopping has been around for a very long time now, how many local retailers have embraced this? Very few.

I cannot believe there are those who honestly believe local trade is losing out solely over a 5% GST exemption on imports <£240. Newsflash - you are more than 5% expensive to start with, so forcing 5% GST on all imports will not change ANYTHING with regards to purchase habits. Most local retailers offer lousy service, poor choice and prices that are obnoxious compared to the easily accessible competition.

Whether 5% GST is forced on all imports or not will not affect online purchasing volumes. Funds should certainly not be directed from such a venture into 'Protecting' and 'Bandaiding' local retail. Why are we even entertaining this ludicrous notion that local retail needs protecting at the cost of the tax payer?

James

Bizarre. Who would collect it? Amazon?

Or would every incoming item in the post have to be held at customs and we go and pay the 5%?

Desperate thinking from a man who just seems to be losing his coffee beans.

mr man

What next a pc tax ? Tax to go on holiday. Less cargo coming in more jobs will be lost.

James

Oh, and does Mr Warr really believe that price differentials between town shops and the Internet are just 5%? So exactly how effective would such protectionism actually be?

Observer

Mr Warr is trying to save businesses that are doomed to extinction because even if we were taxed they still wont be able to compete on price and more specifically choice.

My wife wanted a branded padded jacket - a local department store with the franchise had 1 colour and only a couple in stock. Internet choice was about 12 colours in all sizes.

I wanted a stockmans coat - the stockist had medium and small sizes only and wasnt interested in ordering any more.

I will carry on internet shopping just for the choice alone.

Mr Warr get real and get current

Jersey Born&Breed

In light of the over inflated fuel prices & now increased parking, why would I want to incur the cost of going to town to pay for goods with over inflated prices, that's if what I want to purchase is actually available locally which 9/10 times it isn't! If local retailers are suffering a decline in business then they need to adjust their business plans accordingly, offering online services, reducing prices & providing the items people want to buy. I purchase everything apart from my weekly shopping online because that is the only way I can purchase the items I want at a price I can afford. Myself & my family are Jersey born & breed & it is us who have to pay for the immigrants, rich & who ever else fancies coming to live in Jersey, which is why we can't afford to shop in the local shops!! About time Mr Warr lived in the real, Jersey persons world.

puffin

And this comes from a man who only appears to employ immigrant labour in his shops!

The cost of collecting the GST will cost the tax payers far more than they make from it, they will need hundreds of staff to collect it, and will these staff be locals or imported immigrants?

I personally try to shop in locally run places that employ locals that I can engage in conversation with, even if their prices are higher I know that they have far bigger overheads than an Amazon warehouse in the middle of nowhere. I also recommend shops with friendly local service to other people.

I have noticed lately that M&S seems to be employing more young locals, and have walked out with a smile on my face quite a few times recently after a friendly conversation at the check out.

La Moye Squirrel

Absolutely Puffin. And the bank.

Sam

Re Jersey born and breed.I am one of those immigrants.What do you pay for me? Answer on the back of a postage stamp please

adder st helier

theres a boat in the morning we jersey people will pay for that

Sam

Re Adder You cannot guarantee the boat will sail.I wondered how long it would take for the immigrants are to blame for all comment, you sir or madam and your ilk should get about more often maybe you should try walking to Guernsey and take your miserable comments with you.

Michael

Sam we cant walk on water can you? but we could fly you to Guernsey no trouble

Sam

Michael sometimes I despair.When did you learn to fly? Have you grown wings? Take your xenophobia elswhere the world is a bigger place than you think.

David

Unfortunately, Sam, it is those of use who do "get out more" who can identify the issues that are spoken of.

Rather than express your usual bigotry, perhaps you might be better placed to comment if you were to think before you commit yourself to writing.

The world is indeed a bigger place than you think, Unfortunately, many who come here seem to think that Jersey is their only destination.

Sam

David can you please explain my bigotry.I never once mentioned bigotry.The topic of discussion on this post is about GST.Some have now railroaded the discussion once again to the immigrant population being responsible for GST. The comment I replied to was the comment made up by Jersey born and breed where he says he pays for immigrants, again no response from him are you under the same assumption? that you pay for us. I sir have lived and worked in this beatiful island for forty years or so always paid my way as many do. I do not like being told by you or indeed others of the same mindedness of you, theres a boat in the morning .Tell me though do you really think that Jersey suddenly and magically appeared, with just Jersey born here or do you think immigration has been around for thousands of years.Again answer on a postage stamp

David

The intolerance and bigotry which may be attributed to you is evident within your commentary. It is a pervasive theme. The misuse of the term, "xenophobia", for example, is an indication of small-minded thought, as is the sentiment that those who hold an opinion with which you don not agree should take more frequent social outings.

I am not surprised that cannot see it, but perhaps the fact that it has been pointed out will provoke some introspection.

The matter of walking to Guernsey, by the way, was raised by you, yet you seemed unable to deal with the response which it inevitably attracted.

Sam

David Let me tell you something or even where to look as I have said in my comment.XenophobeA person unduly fearful of contemptuos of that which is foreign,especially of strangers or foreign peoples now you can I am sure look this up.Not forgetting that I sir am the immigrant so thus I am the foreigner I will not be told that anyone pays for me as I am more than capable of paying my own way.Oh and by the way I have trvelled a little from UK to Jersey. Lovin it

Bave

In the light of the over inflated fuel prices & now increased parking, why would I want to incur the cost of going to town to pay for goods with over inflated prices, that’s if what I want to purchase is actually available locally which 9/10 times it isn’t! If local retailers are suffering a decline in business then they need to adjust their business plans accordingly, offering online services, reducing prices & providing the items people want to buy. I purchase everything apart from my weekly shopping online because that is the only way I can purchase the items I want at a price I can afford. Myself & my family are Jersey born & breed & it is us who have to pay for the immigrants, rich & who ever else fancies coming to live in Jersey, which is why we can’t afford to shop in the local shops!! About time Mr Warr lived in the real, Jersey persons world.

Westminster

We Jersey people pay for your university course and will have paid for your schooling.

Sam

Westminter I pay we pay taxes you,unless you paid tax in UK have contributed absolutley nowt to my education.

Westminster

Yes, I is paying taxes and when they go into the public funds then they is paid to absoluttey nowt all of us.

Realist

What David Warr is proposing won't save local shop retailers from the internet buying revolution.You can find the best price at the touch of a button on a laptop and calling for GST to be levied on all goods under £240 when it will cost more to collect is absurd and mean spirited.It won't save Jersey retailers.A shop front with high rental and staff costs cannot compete with an internet sales warehouse. Take the example of the UK High street retail chains who pressured their government to close down our fufillment industry. Many of them are now going bust as we have seen recently, regardless.This move is without any economic merit and should be rejected as such.

roombay42

Got to comment 58 before there was one logically thought out response.

Congratulations, Realist.

One thing that would help would be free parking for up to two hours in town with a no return for 6 hours condition.

Andre

You make a good point about shop rentals. Everyone is calling local shops "greedy" without acknowledging the consequences of the high rents they pay. Jersey has been happy to watch (and profit) as property prices rocketed for the past 50 years. That has driven operating costs, and indeed wage levels. That has taken local retailing precisely to the place where it now finds itself. It can't compete. Meanwhile most people are now on a spiral of a shrinking disposable income. Indeed Jersey's economy as a whole is on a decline.

We need property prices and rentals to adjust to a realistic level. That means they need to drop. But don't expect any call for this, or any action by our Government. There is far too much vested interest in keeping property prices high. Even the Chamber of Commerce is strangely quiet on this. Instead, expect repeated calls to 'grow the population to grow the economy'. This has the convenient side effect of keeping property prices inflated. It was always this way. No one seems to notice that our over inflated property bubble is now suffocating the real economy. And what do we get? More calls to support more development projects for which there is no market! Will Jersey never learn? Does it have to make the same mistakes as Ireland and Spain?

adder

jersey is finished who would pay a tax dodging company who employs imigrant labour for something only worth quater of asking price

Overpopulated

I agree with what you say, especially with out incompetant States members who see the way forward to keep building.

Barely a week passes without a call for a new hospital, new police station, build anothe car park - and the icing on the cake - build over the useful and pleasant car park to build more office blocks, despite the To Let Signs all over St Helier.

Oh and more houses - despite the fact there are currently 2,000/3,000 properties for sale and many empty.

How long before Jersey is like Ireland and knocking down 'ghost housing estates'?

And more importantly - WHERE IS ALL THE MONEY COMING FROM - they must be over £1 BILLION with their grand ideas already!

Sandie

ISLANDERS who shop online should pay GST on all goods, whatever their cost!

So if I buy something from Amazon costing

£5-00

I will have to pay 25p GST and how will I pay that? and how much will it cost you to collect it?

The sixthbsense

Another absolutely disgraceful idea.....Let's think of a way to protect our profit margins by preventing the public from shopping online..protectionism again and again. Never mind the retailers having to adapt, instead let's stop the public from getting deals elsewhere and force them to buy excessive and inflated local prices!!!

sporran

This is a complete u turn on his arguments about LVCR.

trigger26

I predict a lot of people leaving the island which a lot of the people on here will be delighted about. David war does not live in the real jersey where life is tough or he would understand that some things are half price and delivered to your door without paying more for your parking in town.me thinks some shop keepers have promised to be on his side come elections.Go on put the tax up.

people need an out of town shopping experience anyway,so maybe put it up in portelet!or the waterfront an charge everybody for breathing the air on re-claimed land that they paid to dump on,and they pay taxes to keep running.

Middle ground

As we already seem to pay more to live on the island, why is it we now need to be charged again when we order goods that jersey can't stock on the shelves. We pay taxes, we pay more for food then the whole of the UK... Are we hoping to give the island back as a nature reserve and we all just leave.

Grrrrrr

This wont stop people buying on line cos its STILL cheaper. Yes, greed, greed and more greed.

ragpud

Jersey you have created your own monster! Now you want joe public to pay the cost of your mistakes. Once upon a time this island was duty free {a tax free haven }?. But because of bad gambles wich have occured over the years you now expect the regular working class folk to foot the bill. G.S.T a T.L.A. meaning " Go somewhere else tourists " is most certainly having that desired effect. wakey wakey people!

James

I thought visitor numbers were up last year?

.

David Warr, yes once again

He’s on about the trade

The Jersey retail scene

Which coins it in in spades

He really doesn’t get it,

With an apologetic cough

He still can’t see what’s going on

When people get ripped off

So local people, off they go,

They really don’t think twice

They’re sick and tired of hearing

That “we cannot match the price”

“I’ve been to see the manager

He’s just come out the loo

The price he’ll give you is Jersey’s best

It’s all that we can do”

So that is why the internet

Will always be the choice

The retailers-they well know that

Which is why they make a noise

They think that putting on the tax

Will stop this imposition

Without a thought, they have no grasp

Of healthy competition

So go on, Dave

Keep on your quest

Don’t wear that soap box down

And don’t let’s see you rest your case

‘til Jersey’s a ghost town

jerseythepartiesover

only 6 hours in 65 comments, do you know when you get the feeling to just shut up?

wan

He just doesn't get it ! It would mean many more civil servant custom officers checking tens of 1000'a more small parcels. Madness !

Archie Rondel

David Warr you are a hypocrite. On one hand you want us to pay GST on all goods coming into the island yet on the other hand you do NOTHING to expose your members who quite blatantly CHARGE VAT + GST on thier goods .An extra 25% which we should'nt be paying.Talk about adding insult to injury. The old saying comes to mind Mr. Warr ......wake up and smell the coffee. I too will not be buying any more goods from your shop or cafe. Remember what you said about employing Polish staff in your shops. The vast majority never spend a penny in our local shops,restaurants or bars. They send all thier money back home,so why not tackle that " little" problem while your at it.

GordonP

Lets get real. Jersey is only the equivalent of a small town in population and if we use the UK as an example, what has happened to the high streets? They are dead or dying!

St. Helier Resident

I wonder when Mr. Warr will finally realise that he is fighting a losing battle and the only way to stop people from buying goods online will be to ban internet shopping from Jersey completely! Mind you I wouldn't be surprised if he suggests exactly that idea next!

I'm so fed up with being ripped off by Jersey's ever spiralling prices and wish that I was able to buy everything I needed online, but, unfortunately I'm unable to get my hair cut or nails done via the internet!

Si

Very little of what I buy online (if any of it) can be bought locally. It would not be in any local shop's interests to hold it as stock. I have no issue paying GST on it, but that's barely anything if I'm honest, so neither public services, not the local shops, will benefit from this move in my case.

LDL

Excellent example of over inflated prices here in jersey.

One weekend I was internet shopping on Local Jewellery stores websites for a birthday present.

One store has a website but its run by the UK store and i found the perfect item i wanted

.

Thinking buy local I decided to check out the stores in town to see if i could either purchase the same item or find something else which i liked better.

After walking around town checking out every jewellery store i didn't see anything i liked but i did find a store that did the item i had seen on the internet which was marked up at £415.

I went to the websites local branch here in jersey to see if they had the item in stock and was told that they didn't hold some of the items on the website in store but i could order the item from the site and if i had any problems with it i could take it to them. I must admit the local store was very helpful and answered all my questions making me very happy to order from their site.

I went straight home and ordered the item before they sold out.

Mr Warr the big difference in price £415 to £230 (reduced from £330 in sale) making a big saving. And sort of bought locally.

bluejay

I needed to replace a relatively simple light fixture. The largest local electrical dealer had nothing in stock but some pretty expensive unsuitable ones which would mean I'd have to redecorate. I was handed a pile of catalogues which did have something suitable. Ordering said item would take 5 -6 weeks! Ordering the exact item over the internet cost ~ 15% less and it was delived to my home 4 days later - so even if you try to buy locally you get no satisfaction (or service).

Simple Sid

Ha Ha I take my hat off to Warr he really is trying, I will continue to shop on line even if GST is added some goods are still cheaper, no parking issue, no bull from traffic wardens, no rude shop operatives and what Mr Warr is missing here if retailers had not been so greedy when times were good and looked after there customers, they proberly wouldn't be in dire straits now. AND REMEMBER THERE IS WORST TO COME.

COM-Mentator

Mr Warr should maybe focus on service from the illiterate staff most shops now employ - i am tired of being served by non english speaking staff who grunt when asked a question - and maybe charge realistic prices - have a go at extortionate town rents - than suggest that his proposition is nothing more than an attempt to boost his profits.

Alan

So David wants us to pay GST on all purchases? This from a man who presumably has NEVER purchased anything using the Internet and whose ‘’Jersey Based Coffee Shop does not strictly pay Tax … DW only paying tax as a Shareholder on his annual payout’’!!

(Channel Television Business Club 24/10/12

http://www.channelonline.tv/channelonline_business_club/DisplayArticle.asp?ID=502031)

Bean online

I went into a furniture shop last October. I had seen a suite I liked in there for £1499, and found it online £200 cheaper (including delivery). I went back to the shop and said that I would be happy to meet them half way and would they sell it to me for £1399. The guy almost threw me out of his shop.

Furthermore, after ordering it online, it arrived within 6 weeks, 6 weeks quicker than the local shop had quoted on my original enquiry.

Shop online; it's cheaper, faster, better!

Alan

This from a man whose Coffee Shop do not pay Jersey Tax!

the thin wallet

your kiding me?

so this joker wants to put taxes up for the rest of us whilst his firm suck the bowl dry?

Taxpayer

I cannot believe what I am reading about Mr Warr,this man is another Gerald Ratner, a Prawn Sandwich,he has just shot himself in the foot,I personally E Mailed Mr Warr a couple of weeks ago because I was so incensed with him muting the fact that we are not paying our fare share of taxes,,,GST,he replied via Chamber of Commerce 17thJan ,telling me that we all have to pay our fare share so that the Hospitals,Schools Etc can be financed,if as stated that this man is not paying his fare share of taxes,and will only employ immigrant labour,as I assume it is more cost effective,this man has a lot of questions to answer,he seriously needs to get his toys back in the cupboard.

Simple Sid

Don't really know why this guy is on Chamber.

Mack

I think what's funnier is that you can buy products from the website's of UK chains that are in Jersey and get the VAT knocked off.

An example was a friend purchased a coat, it was £69.99 UK price, she then rang the local store, guess what, they had it and it was £69.99 (inc GST). She then checked website again, they wouldn't deliver to the local store, but they would knock VAT off and only charged £3 delivery. So total price from internet £61.32 (from said shop's own website), now even with GST added at import, it would still only have been £64.39, £5.60 cheaper than the local store!!

Sorry Mr Head in Clouds, It's going to take more than GST on imports to save the high street.

Even a Big Mac meal (excl tax) is £1.00 more expensive here, and well TGI's is about (excl tax) £5.00 more expensive for a steak.

Perhaps the real problem is actually the extortionate rents shops are being charged for doing business here.

Northern Shopper

Let me give you some examples of some headline items that I have sourced from the Internet because they are cheaper including shipping, VAT & GST. I could have bought the same items in Jersey but chose not too because of price and in one case the attitude of the staff who sadly have now been made redundant.

Trampoline - Jersey price £700, on-line price £350 plus GST. This was for the same item (make, model etc) but the on-line item included additionally a ladder and tie down kit. The UK company arranged shipping to my house in the total cost in lieu of VAT deduction.

Camera - Jersey price £1100, on-line price £750 plus GST. This item was cheaper on the local shops UK parents web site than it was in the Jersey store. When I challenged the staff about this they told me to go and buy it on-line then. As I turned to leave one of them said but they wont ship to Jersey ha ha ha, so I bought it on-line at another retailer and the shop has now closed with the loss of jobs - are you surprised.

DVD - Went into a well known retailer of music and video on King Street and even with their 25% sale it is still cheaper to buy from the Internet - which I have done. This is a company in administration who are desperate for cash to stay afloat.

The regulator has supposedly looked at retail pricing and shipping costs but we see no change. Why is food at the well known Clothing and food retailer higher than UK prices? The shop made the argument a few years ago that it cost more to ship blah, blah but yet the shipments share the same boat, lorries as goods for their other shops which did/do not charge the same supplement.

The regulator is protecting some large companies or individuals that unfortunately will see KIng Street and Queen Street empty before long.

Parktown Prawn

Shame about the shopping assistant laughing.....but with those savings didn't they realise you could fly to the mainland to buy it yourself and it would have still been cheaper!!

What idiots.....!

I have heard stories that Jersey milk and new potatoes can be bought in the UK cheaper than in Jersey!!

(I haven't looked to buy these products from the UK myself so cannot confirm)

the thin wallet

the regulator .

what a damp squib.

another thing the taxpayer is paying for no doubt that offers very little in return.

R. Williams

It appears that you do your shopping at foreign owned shops and stores. Try shopping at local establishments, generally prices and service are better. Obviously they can't compete with Amazon who provide no sales service, pay warehouse rents, employ hourly paid workers, are domiciled in Luxembourg so they only pay 3% income tax, have special deals with their shippers, don't hold stock or have it on a sale or return basis so they never have any dead stock and take a huge commission from those companies selling through their website.

Your local shop pays rent and rates, buys stock which may or may not sell, (if it doesn't they're stuck with it at a loss), employs staff who get holidays and sickness pay and social security paid, the owner of the business pays income tax at at least 20%

and helps with advice about your purchase. Plus you can see and touch it. Also, I know many customers that use the local shops for research before buying on the internet, so stealing the local shop owner of his time and knowledge.

cheekymonkey

Hi guys, how petty are you, i work in retail and proberbly earn a lot less than lots of you... many shops are trying their hardest to do what they can under hard circumstances, the rents will never be that low to compete against amazon, and you have a choice but dont moan when you are supporting us when we are unemployed and there are no shops left at all, even at christmas time and your orders go wrong or are delayed. try to help us keep our happy (good customer service)faces by relising that we can not give in to your demands every time!!

Robert

5% will still be worthwhile to buy online looking at the price difference. But it is not just price....choice, service convenience are all key.

It is likely that the main problem is the level of rents and this is an issue in the residential market made worse by the rent rebate system. Chamber should focus on this, or are they too conflicted by being material owners of retail spaces that they prefer to focus on fleecing the customers?

But let's focus on Mr Warr and Coopers. Nice new coffee shop at Castle Quay on the Waterfront. Went last Saturday with my wife for a coffee and a bun before Cinema. Shop was busy and 8+ people in the queue behind us at 4.50.

We are told we close at 5 (!) so do you want it to go! Well no because it is cold so we went to The Bar and had a very nice coffee there.

Some service closing at 5 on a location near a Cinema on what is supposed to be an entertainment hub and with obvious demand. I will not bother with the extra few steps next time and The Bar can have my custom.

Mr Warr you have paid your rent, staff costs are not that high in the industry and the cost of making a cup of coffee (probably the highest margin item in catering) is so low that you would make a profit if you reminded open. Time you look at how you run your own business' along with your friends in the Chamber and focus on what you can do to improve your lot that does not involve protectionism and assuming you are owed a living and can fleece your customers and offer a por service.

Propaganda

I suggest Mr Warr and his fellow struggling retailers change course and invest in Jerseys fastest growing business, parcel deliveries. Adding 5% gst to my cat food, pasta, toilet rolls, baked beans, rice, cat litter, clothes, shoes, electrical items, beds, mattresses, furniture etc all ordered online will not stop me. So Mr Warr if you want to make some income from my spending I suggest you get in to the delivery business.

Gf

adder st helier

the new giggle bit will make internet shopping even quicker thanks to ouzof

Tobias

David Warr again, the man who refuses to employ locals and yet regularly preaches that we should all PAY TWICE BUY LOCAL (even though the signs for said campaign were printed in England).

Don't worry, this little nonsensical bleating of his will never come to fruition - already Customs dept have said that they are unable to monitor the ports succesfully as they are too busy checking GST, lowering the threshold would be unmanageable.

Back to the drawing board, Mr Warr - try to think up another punitive measure to stop the evil online shoppers.

S G

Does this man live in the real world.

I have just returned from a self catering holiday in the Canaries which is about a thousand miles from Spain and everything comes in by boat, which is a two day crossing,not a couple of hours like ours.

The majority of fresh food is about half the price of here. Petrol is 25p

cheaper, a pint of lager $1.20. a pint of John Smiths £ 2.00.

I think it is time that something is done to stop us from being ripped off, especially Sandpiper. In the last couple of months they have put up the price of a bagette by 19% and a yoghurt by 20%.and if the M D of Sandpiper disputes this,I have the till receipts to prove this.

Parktown Prawn

I'd like to see a poll of how many local politicians buy online.

Also, where does this Warr get his coffee beans from? They are certainly not grown locally.....FFS, most of his staff aren't even local!

He likes to use cheap labour, no doubt has some sort of GST "exemption" on his own imported products.....and yet he expects the rest of us to fork out for him.......

Between the likes of him and Crowcroft they are doing everything possible to destroy St Helier......we should be asking why that is. What is their REAL agenda?

Restricted parking at ridiculous prices, forcing people to shop at home, poor shopping experiences for the few that have to shop locally, not to mention sky high prices......what do you expect Warr?

Guernsey does not have GST, they have many online shoppers too......so how are they coping in retail?

This island is fast becoming a dictatorship which is in breach of a fundamental human right in itself......the Right to Democracy!!

It's about time you and you ilk started listening to the people before you cause more social unrest!

Mona Lisa

Considering the savings you can make online, 5% GST will not make the slightest bit of difference..

I have to watch my pennies so shop around online to get best value.. as most retailers take the VAT off the savings can be huge if you use an online retailer that wont charge the earth the ship to Jersey

Last year my god daughter reached her 21st... so I decided to buy her a watch..It was cheaper for me to buy the watch online using the website of Ernest Jones then actually buy the watch from Ernest Jones in King Street

People dont want to pay huge parking fees, to visit a shop that has no choice and to be faced with shop assistants that can barely speak english.I can sit at my computer in my lunch hour eating my lunch whilst shopping , saving money and being warm and dry knowing I am not being fleeced

Beaumont

The problem for David Warr is people have stopped listening to him. He has hit us with so many ludicrous, laughable statements over the years, nobody takes him seriously anymore

Richard

Was it not just reported last week that nearly all shops in town are leased, not vacant, so this is a mass contradiction that they are loosing several high street shops. The digital age has taken over yes, so there is no purpose for a HMV, a Jessops or other in that category as they are all past their sell by date, and also designer and general clothes, toiletries and even food can all be bought online and delivered to the door for half the cost of Jersey. Retailers, lower your prices to that of the internet and customers will return to your shops. You have all been far too greedy for far too long and now you have your comeuppance so stop moaning. They will be campaigning to prevent mail from the UK coming to Jersey next!

Andre

Richard, LANDLORDS need to lower their rents, which would allow shops to lower their prices. But this is Jersey, and I suspect the skies would darken with swarms of flying pigs before that happens!

James

Why do they need to lower rents? Or rather, why should they?

They will lower rents when supply exceeds demand, and given that whenever a developer wants to build anything the nimbys object, that ain't happening any time soon.

And shops charge what they charge because Jersey is affluent and we're prepared to pay them. Well, we were, but someone invented this Internet thing.

Alison

I bought furniture online and even with the delivery cost I saved over £3000 than the cost of Jersey. I priced everything I wanted in the shops here, then sourced it online direct from manufactures or discount stores and got it all direct. My 46in Sony TV was £299 on offer, £659 in Wholesale Electrics. My 2 leather sofas cost £700 on offer at DFS, delivered free, Jersey price for the same sofas was £1000 each. I will say no more.

roombay42

Did you pay the local retailer for his time and advice or did you just make use of him, i.e. stole his time?

NB

Why would she do that? Retailers are not paid on a time basis they are paid on the products they sell. If they are unable to sell the product either through their inability as a sales person or because they are greedy with their prices then that is their problem not the consumers.

roombay42

But you are using their knowledge and time. Do you work for nothing?

Lost it

The internet provides all the research you need - we don't need local sales staff, who don't know their products, have a poor attitude and won't negotiate. That is why sales are lost. Wake up and smell the coffee....

NB

No roombay i do not, but then i work in an industry where we charge by the hour for the products/services we sell.

Having said that if i am selling something to my clients (ie trying to get them to pay for a potential piece of work) of course i will not be charging them for my time in a pre-sales scenario.

Propaganda

roombay42, this is how it goes for me.

I do my research all online, that way I can see the reviews of people who have bought and used the products I am considering buying. For me that is more important than the sales pitch from staff in the local shop.

Once I have decided which make and model to buy I go to local shop and look at price, I do not speak to the staff or ask for a demo. If it is within a few percent of the online price I will buy it. I have saved them the time and effort of giving me a sales pitch and demo 'cos I have done my research online.

If the price is way over the top compared to online I go home and order it, sadly this happens far more often than finding a comparable price locally.

DJ

Well said that man with the long name.

roombay42

Propaganda: I respect your attitude but I'm afraid you are not typical of today's shopper who treats the local, n.b. local, retailer with disrespect for their efforts.

Neil

Roombay.

You talk about stealing shopkeepers time. I'm curious to

know if you have any work done at your property ie. builder or plumber, do you accept the first quote you get, or do you get several quotes and compensate the losing tradesmen for their time doing the quote? Unless you are renting, which I then assume you either took the first property you looked at, or looked at several properties and compensated the losing landlords for their time showing you around?

Parktown Prawn

....or the flipside....we could start charging retailers for our time when browsing their stores ;-)

roombay42

Neil.

There is a subtle difference between getting comparisons with the intention of purchasing locally and using the retailer to assess the goods locally with the intention of purchasing off-island.

mrmarket

OK legislate to add 5% to all imports (backed up by a business case) as long as at the same time we legislate that no business can list items at UK rrp, simple you can have 5% to level the market and we can have UK vat taken out of the price. Simple.

In all seriousness I'd suggest Mr Warr and his members listen to the likes of Mr Pearce posting above. The market has changed and business need to change not continue to reorginise the deck chairs while the water is around retailers ankles.

A more helpful approach would be taking gst out entirely by reducing the cost of our government which the private sector could be helping with not hindering.

Jerseylicious (retired)

I think Mr Warr must be "Lost in Space", can he honestly say that he's never shopped "on-line" ? Instead of being "ripped off" locally!

Here are two real, personal examples, of the greediness of those that he represents.

Firstly a locally based "online retailer" operating from Rue des Pres, Trading Estate, who charged the full UK VAT on an item, even though it never left Jersey, but was merely delivered the half mile to my house! When contacted even the Manager agreed that they should have only charged local GST, but refused to reimburse the difference!

Secondly, buying a local interest book, Amazon price £16.20 including P&P, whereas the Jersey price of £26.95 (£25 + GST @ £1.95) works out about 65% higher! Due to circumstances beyond my control on this occasion I was forced to allow myself into being "mugged" and pay the much higher local price!

As a Jersey person yes...I'd much prefer to support local businesses, but lets have a fair deal, invariably the range of goods here is vastly inferior, quoted delivery times are excessive (compared to "on-line retailers", who often provide next day delivery) and prices on the sort of goods that I buy are normally +/- 40% higher here.

What Mr Warr seems to forget is that we live in the real world where getting the best value for our money is really important, especially at a time when savings earn less, and wages for most are frozen.

I'm afraid the old excuses of freight charges, and rents being higher in Jersey, don't make up the difference any more.

Nothappy

Ok i see everyone is getting worked up again.

Internet retailers can charge lower prices because

1. They pay cheap rent on large warehouses.

2. They can buy in bulk and thus get discount from manufacturers

3. They pay staff UK minimum wage - last time i checked that was a lot less than minimum wage here.

Local retailers have none of those advantages and then get fleeced by the freight company and utility companies for the privilege of running a shop here.

As for Sandpiper - well they are what they are, but everyone has been clamouring for more choice for years - they bring it and you still aren't happy!

BeanThereDoneThat

Oh dear Mr Warrant must be limping badly after shooting himself so well in both feet. I wonder if by chance his next career move will be to start up a PR agency.

Looks like the coffee shop business is dead in the water, the Old adage sometimes better that people think you are a fool, than to open your mouth and convince them.

Keep shopping on line at least it keeps harbours, airports and our postal service busy, we need them a lot more than we need Mr Warrs overpriced coffee and tea.

Tara

Coopers Coffee - Jura Impressa espresso machine £1240 undelivered. Same Jura Impressa espresso machine £699 jura dot com.

Robert

Mr Warr please justify that difference even if we pay the 5% GST show how you are not profiteering ....after all you do not have high duty on these items compared to fuel etc!

Propaganda

Bodum 3 cup cafetiere, amazon price £17.05 delivered. Coppers Jersey price £22.60 not delivered.

Delonghi ICN 2B filter coffee machine, amazon price £16.66 delivered. Coopers Jersey price £31.00 not delivered.

Yes that's right folks the delonghi machine can be bought online for half price, delivered to your own home with a few clicks. No dificulty or cost of parking, no hassle of carrying it up the stairs at Minden Place car park. Hassle free half price shopping, think once and buy online.

Shall we carry on Mr Warr (Ratner)?

Clearly a 5% import GST on these products would not help make your prices even remotely competitive. Do your research please before suggesting ideas that will only produce extra cost to the tax payer, not extra business for local suppliers.

Nathan

Waste of time collecting GST on anything imported thats costs under £100, cost you more to administer it.

As for retailers ripping people off, it would be interesting to know what their profit margins are.......

Kermit

I never understood why we are not paying GST with the online shopping (cost too much to process for a small order I guess). Everything should be taxed the same or not at all. It s not fair for local retailers.

It is just logical.

Not that I want to pay more, but fairly and logically it seems right.

This is going to cost us more to check all the parcels. 20 more jobs to be advertised soon with the customs.

Scrap that GST once for all and get someone qualified in charge of the Treasury, not someone who had a C in Math at his exams...

We ve been bozoufed for too long...

Overpopulated

Not sure how they are going to charge GST on downloaded music and on line gambling

R. Williams

It would be fairer if GST was not charged on goods under £240.00 sold by local retailers. This would probably do more to lower the local cost of living than anything else. Indeed, as foreign businesses do not pay local income tax, the local sales figure should be in the region of £300.00.

sideline

ha ha its ok for the big company's to put all the small shops out of business but they dont like it when the customer goes online and gets a better deal . well i will shop on line even with extra tax '

realyst

There is the odd soldier that thinks everyone else is marching out of line at #82. This attitude demonstrates the aggressive and unhelpful traits seen by many shop assistants that Islanders dislike. No one owes you a living.

Every time Warr opens his mouth, the proverbial foot goes. But this is not just about the price element. Which is already many times the 5% number. Service in shops is appalling, with disinterest and rudeness. You need to try harder, retailers.

Instead of allowing your staff to file their nails or chat amongst themselves whilist customers wait to interrupt their day, hand them a product manual to read up on the key selling points - so at least when a customer does manage to gain their attention, they can answer a question. Whilst you are at it, they can read up on how to deliver quality customer service. They will have lots of time during the day waiting for the rare local without internet access to drift into their outlet.

Underpinning this is the economic position. Many people simply cannot afford to pay the premium attached to 'buy local'. It is no longer a question of choice. In this climate, the direction of shopping habits flows like a river to the lowest price point, and there is nothing that can be done about that dynamic. Either go with the flow, or dry up.

PJK

I attended a few politcal party meetings 2 years ago when David Warr was the guest speaker, and can he speak!

He said on one occasion that he would welcome Tesco into Jersey, I did not believe him then and I do not now, he said he could easily compete with them, I did not believe him then, I do not believe him now.

I do believe however, that this man has caused more damage then he realised, most of it to himself!!!!!!!

.

There was a young man called Dave

who didn't like people to save

he wanted a tax

to get his own back

on the way that the shoppers behaved

C@rLiNHo5

MR. DAVID WARR PUBLIC ENEMY NUMBER ONE... No more coffee from your business thank you very much, I hope you realise you've just shot yourself in the foot, I should expect your figures to plummet even more after this statement. Perhaps the States of Jersey should charge that extra tax to the greedy retail space landlords & out of touch shopkeepers who sell well above value, they can afford it the robbing thieves!! Fed up of these stupid laws, HAD ENOUGH OF THEM!!!! WE ALL HAVE!!!!!!!!!

jim

warr prepare to close your shops you have just done a ratner i will never buy coffee from you again you dont pay tax you dont employ local people you do things on the cheap so why cant the rest of us you are finished bye

Mr GST

The simply answer is NO! The dictatorship of our government should not have introduced this tax in the first instance. It has created poverty and the demise of several businesses. A good exemple of stealth tax is the introduction of parking charges which was supposed to improve our roads and transport system. Anyone seen any new trams or monorails passing you rway recently

Bilbo Beghins

Why not stand in the next election for the People's Democratic Bean Republic of Jersey Party ? Then you could ban the internet all together.

George

I got tired of the rants of Mr Warr a long time ago. I bought a neat little machine (amazon, no quibbles) and have a couple of coffees before I leave the house each morning. You can charge me 200% GST and I'll still be quids in.

Grow some Mr Warr.

p.s. I had some of your coffee at a Chamber lunch before Xmas, can't say it was the best advert ever produced!

David Rotherham

One effect it would be likely to have is massively reducing consumer choice. Many firms might find it easier to blacklist Jersey as a destination they do not do business with than set up to pay Jersey GST.

This is not a flight of fancy: In 2011,I bought something online from Indigo Starfish, across the road from my own workplace. Only to find they would not sell to Jersey customers, presumably to avoid GST, as their main trade was based on dodging UK VAT. If even local firms don't want to get involved with GST on online sales, what chance the big boys will?

Even so, the best deals will still be online for those who can be bothered and don't need after-sales service.

Reg

What after sales service?

roombay42

Typical nonsense comment from someone who obviously doesn't give local retailers a chance. Shop at locally owned and run shops and you'll find really good service. If you shop at English chains run anonymously from abroad and you shouldn't expect the same level of commitment.

Tersel

Eh? Are you having a laugh?

DJ

I think he is.

In the words of Winton Hurstill...."never have so many sales been lost, by so few people, with such poor service"

23)(

Let’s just think about this for a moment by documenting some straight facts/questions.

I was going to actually write up a full report within the next fortnight as I believe that I can prove by deduction that Mr Warr is not acting in the best interest of local businesses, but in fact that the CHAMBER OF COMMERCE is now in fact a GOVERNMENT TAX LOBBY GROUP.

CHAMBER OF COMMERCE IS NOW DEAD IN JERSEY! BOYCOTT ALL MEMBERS

However, ive decided not to as I don’t want to patronise the general public to what is quite obvious.

Just a few general points then 

Opening Paragraph on wiki...Chamber of Commerce

A chamber of commerce (also referred to in some circles as a board of trade) is a form of business network, e.g., a local organization of businesses whose goal is to further the interests of businesses. Business owners in towns and cities form these local societies to advocate on behalf of the business community. Local businesses are members, and they elect a board of directors or executive council to set policy for the chamber. The board or council then hires a President, CEO or Executive Director, plus staffing appropriate to size, to run the organization.

A chamber of commerce is not a governmental body or institution, and has no direct role in the writing and passage of laws and regulations that affect businesses. It may however, act as a lobby in an attempt to get laws passed that are favourable to businesses.

FACT 1: So, as it stands, a president of a Chamber of Commerce is in the duty of raising/highlighting issues which are in the direct interests of local businesses.

FACT 2: Mr Warr is requesting a full review of the “De Minimus “level to which Tax is being paid, the cut off level which is currently set at £240.00.

FACT 3: Mr Warr is lobbying for a tax on all online purchases and the current level to be ZERO.

FACT 4: Mr Warr’s argument is that local businesses are highlighting that they believe that they are 5% behind in margins from “stuff” being imported to jersey due to how islanders are ordering items online by the conditions of how tax is collected.

FACT 5: Mr Warr states that “some Islanders are abusing the system by ordering thousands of pounds worth of goods but splitting them into different orders to avoid paying Tax, while others are ordering day-to-day goods instead of using local shops. Mr Warr believes that tax on all items should be collected to help pay for public services etc.

Now I apologise in advance for the robust retort to Mr Warrs actions, im just so angry at the quite blatant corruption of this Man , the Chamber of Commerce has just DIED!

RESPONSE TO FACT ONE

How the hell can David Warr be looking out for the interests of local businesses, its those very same local businesses that are ordering online from those very same distribution groups and then making those mark-ups in their very own shops, how dare he try and make out that the public are abusing the system! Are you saying that the public should appreciate and expect to be ripped off? I am one of those businesses who orders online and then sells the products to my customers, it in no way affects my business.

RESPONSE TO FACT TWO

Out of the 530 members of the COC, show us the members who are being affected by members of the local public..Who in your words …are ordering thousands of pounds worth of products on the basis you have reported. Out of the 530 members of COC , only 67 members sell retail items , and out of those 67 only 7..YES 7 sell items that would traditionally be bought online, so tell me how that justifies the comments you have made with regards to having all online purchases taxed. And more importantly, WHAT THE HELL has the level of the GST to be charged got to do with the interests of those members of the group who you are saying you represent???

RESPONSE TO FACT 3

It’s quite plain to see that you are now a government lobbyist, you have completely destroyed the image of the chamber of commerce and I will not be renewing my 2 memberships in regards to what the Chamber of Commerce is supposed to represent. There is sufficient evidence to prove that there is no way that you can factually prove that businesses are being destroyed because people are purchasing from abroad online, just look at town on any weekday and weekend, it’s absolutely packed, people only purchase online because they are getting ripped off or because they can’t get the items in jersey ! Or should the jersey public appreciate being ripped off? You out of touch incompetent.

RESPONSE TO FACT 4

What an absolute Lie!! Who the hell orders items online, in bulk, that come under the threshold of the limit set. How can you justify that businesses are saying that they are losing 5%, let me enlighten you Mr Warr, the dyeing shops in St Helier is not about the 5%, it’s about the 50%-100% that they are over charging, How dare you suggest that it is wrong for an individual or small business to do THE EXACT SAME AS WHAT THOSE SHOPS ARE DOING IF THEY WANT TO SAVE THEMSELVES 50% AGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!

RESPONSE TO FACT FIVE

Now this is the one that has got me biting my lip, Mr Warr you absolute Government Shill, PUBLIC SERVICES!!!!!! What the hell has that got to do with your position??? You tell us what islanders are ordering thousands of pounds worth of goods to avoid tax…Would it be the exact same people who you are supposed to represent being the members of COC. OH NO, WE WOULDN’T WANT MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC TO HAVING A CHOICE OF BEING RIPPED OFF WOULD WE??

In final summary, your statement has absolutely nothing to do with protecting local businesses, your statements are in the interest of 2 areas, one that you are now a government tax lobbyist, and secondly, you believe that a monopoly should be in the hands of your COC members to how you believe that all local people should be thankful to pay in excess of over 50% on items.

There is no good reason for your argument, I once did respect you, but you have now shown that you are an arm of the tax department.

I can only hope that members see you, and what the COC has become, and get out sharp with regards to what you have represented, I will now never look to purchase any items in jersey; I will shop online all I can now! Something I think the public should do as a point of principal!

SHOP ONLINE! BOYCOTT ALL COC MEMBERS

Sam

Wow I would love to hear David Warrs response. Very well said.

Michael

I will now never look to purchase any items in jersey; I will shop online all I can now! Something I think the public should do as a point of principal!

I have followed this advice for 7 years now, I will not be held hostage by the greed of local shops, buy online easy, cheaper, no parking probems, and I can type and recieve messages in english!!! Nothing will get me shopping in St Helier again and Mr Warrs bad tempered out burst makes me even mors determined !!!

Simple Sid

Well said and I absolutely agree with you, try following this one anyone! Chamber has become a social club.

Phillip Le Quesne

This poster has got it spot on, the Chamber of Commerece Executive Panel has simply become a a group of treasury Shills. I agree, its about time people start to see what business commerece groups/networks are really for, I think the more discerning of us already know that the government are using their friends in the chamber of commerce to simply highlight their own goals but to then hide behind David Warr and James Filleul as puppets.

Shame on you Chamber Of Commerce, David Warr might aswell just have put a States Of Jersey treasury logo on your own website and marketing!!

Because that is exactly what you are now being seen as!

The Realist

Ive got one tip for Mr Warr, shop owners, and staff.

Your days have ended! go and educate yourselves to do something useful!

One world Wally

Does anyone remember adjacent to the market in town?

What was it called, Coopers?

Run by that funny little chap who wanted to force locals to pay higher prices to protect his income.

Tax Payer

.. and boasted about employing only immigrants ...

ronnie

I will still buy my coffee online. Even with gst added still much cheaper. As many say Mr Warr wake up and smell the coffee.

STOP

This has to stop NOW!

Wages have been frozen for years (unless you are a States member!)

Prices are increasing every day on lifes essentials!

Businesses are struggling!

People cannot afford to exist on this island any more!

It is time that someone remembered the hard working members of society in this island.

Give us an incentive to stop shopping on the internet by price matching.

Give us free parking to encourage us back into town to spend the little we have.

Give us a reason to be proud of our island again!

At a time when life is extremely hard, help us to enjoy living again!

Kate

I agree with the majority above.If they put this tax on imported good I will still buyon the internet because it will still work out cheaper however a question. What happens for those who buy on cat books like Freemans etc. I don't personally however for those that do the majority of these goods I understand is sent on approval and you can return. If your paying tax on it coming in how therefore do you get the refund on the returns.Which I would think is the same on anything you return how would you reclaim your tax then.

Also in respect of Conrads comment regarding Sandpiperci. Sounds like an ex disgruntled employee whatever you think of the large company they employ 1600 people on the islands imagin if they left the island that is 1600 unemployed and I for one love the value of George clothing for myself and the children I also value a lot of Iceland products along with my M&S. I even like a Costa Coffee better than Coopers so please if we want value let Sandpiper bring the value in. We can't have it always.

I for one will continue to shop on line but can't work out how the tax will be sorted on return products

C@rLiNHo5

Example of why people shop online. Product: HAT STAND (IDENTICAL MODELS) Found in a store in Jersey, cost £139 / Found on ebay including delivery and choice of colours, cost £17.99. Does Mr. Warr think this is honest? ...I have a proposal, how about you retailers start price matching, how about the States of Jersey charge the retailers a tax that isn't allowed to be passed on to the paying customer, get trading standards/competition watchdog involved, that'll teach them for being so greedy!!

Alan

Re #77 which quotes the CTV Business Club of 24/10/12 commenting that DW’s ‘‘Jersey Based Coffee Shop does not strictly pay Tax … DW only paying tax as a Shareholder on his annual payout’’ the hyperlink has a typo. This should in fact be

http://www.channelonline.tv/channelonline_business_club/DisplayArticle.asp?ID=502031

Having read the many comments posted to date, I agree that DW has definitely done a Ratner / shot himself in the foot. I too will not be using any of his outlets in the future!

Ashley

I predict, by 2020, we'll be taxed on air. Once that settles down, we'll get taxed on the warmth & sunshine that arrives with spring. By 2025, we'll start to have to pay tax on the rain that lands on our gardens.

the thin wallet

the british goverment may be running the show here before 20 20.

thinker

What a bizarre response to Alison at #91. Unfortunately local sales staff expect to be able sell goods with no effort.

In the real world, a sales person has to pitch their product and invest their time in doing so. And they won't win them all.

Plus the price must be in line with the competition. Otherwise all that effort will go unrewarded, but that is the nature of being in sales.

Andy

With high parking charges now ,higher prices in shops even with another 5% on top I'd still buy online...Mr Warr just losing customers by the bucket load here!

Phil

One common theme seems to be that a 5% GST on imported goods would be enough to deter people from buying online, but the cost of collecting the 5% tax would be too high.

I'm not so sure about that.,,,there are only two points of entry, airport and harbour, and all orders come in via mail/parcel or by courier, so it ought to be easy to devise a system whereby the value of the parcel is verified upon collection and paid over there and then.

Maybe a better answer is to make the GST rate 10% and to reduce other taxes to compensate.

The Internet tide is a very strong one and we aren't go to stop it, but we have to replace the lost tax revenues from local businesses and retail jobs.

Matt

An easy way to collect the GST on internet sales is to have the online retailer log on to a Jersey Customs GST internet site, which would calculate the GST to be paid. The retailer would make an online payment, and print out a bar code or identifaction number to stick on the parcel. Then parcels without the above pre-payment would be stopped when entering Jersey.

In the USA some states have 'Sales Taxes', and on-line retailers where ever they are located in America do charge customers state taxes and pass them on to te relivent states in quesion if applicable.

NB

Absolutely Ludicrous.

No retailer is going to bother for what is by comparison a minor number of sales to Jersey and go to all the hassle of having to have an additional process just for Jersey Deliveries, it is simply not worth their time and money.

The US might well have cross state sales tax, however the US also has a much larger population making it economically viable to even bother collecting it.

James

"Easy" way? Not sure many of the hundreds and hundreds of on-line retailers we choose to use would be prepared to do this. Your average State of America is somewhat larger than Jersey.

So, if an on-line retailer did not offer such a facility, you'd have us forming an orderly queue to collect and pay our 60p on a CD would you?

bumble

Please explain why we 'have to replace the lost tax revenues from local businesses and retail jobs'?

Why should the taxpayer bail out Mr Warr and other rip off retailers?

This is a free market Phil, you buy local if you want and I will do what I want but please stop with your nonsense about having to pay again.

You sound like the snitch in class that reminds the teacher to give every homework.

Warren J

I would support GST at 15% as long as our personal allowances were reintroduced.

GST is a bot of a smokescreen - the real damage is being caused by 20 means 20 !

terry

Not sure why this is an issue for small businesses.

According to gov.je, "approximately three quarters of Jersey businesses will not have to register (for GST)and their sales will be GST-free"

So for 3 out of 4 Jersey businesses, noise about GST is all a smoke screen to cover the underlying issues.

James

What's the equivalent to "going viral" on this site? Never seen such a rapid response to a news item.

"Caused a bit of a rumpus"? "Going to Warr"?

Wonder what his views on the paid hospital chaplain are.....

Overpopulated

To be honest, I could not care what his views are on anything.

I hope he reads these many comments and learns, he will then understand why his takings are down...

gray

Asked for a remote control at a well known local supplier. Was told and I quote "If not on shelf Don't have" Assistant than proceeded to talk to their friend in a foreign language. Went home got online and bought what I wanted on Amazon. It arrived in a day! I would sooner pay more online than have to.put up with the seemingly huge amount of not only rude, but also misinformed staff in local shops.

Boycotted

I boycotted Mr Warrs busines last year after the appalling CV fiasco.

I wasn't going to rush back anyway, after visting one of his cafes where the member of staff did not know anything about the cakes she was selling. Shrugged shoulders do not make anybody want to purchase.

Mario

This wouldn't stop me buying online as you already get a very big discount!

I find local shops to be overpriced and under stocked plus the hassle to get into town is not worth it.

R. Williams

Well, Mario, there's a great opening for you. Open your own shop, undercut all the other competition and you'll soon be a millionaire, (according to your theory).

p.s. Don't expect any sympathy from your lucky customers when you go bankrupt which wouldn't be long as you obviously have never had anything to do with retailing and haven't a clue.

Miles

The problem is that everyone is against each other. It's never gonna end and will just go downhill. Good Luck to all.

William R

Surely the opposite is the case? Mario points out that buying on line presents the best value for money so he is hardly likely to open a local retail outlet, is he?

I did not read any comment or even suggestion within his post whereby he expects to become a millionaire.

Any identifiable theory seems to indicate the exact opposite in fact.

R. Williams

William R.

Re-read my post, you've missed the point.

William R

Could you explain it, please?

Mario

R.W. why would I want to get involved in a dead end business?

Retail in Jersey had it too easy for too long. In fact I would say that many took the p155 knowing we had no option but to pay what they demanded. Some even said as much to me.

Well now the boot is well and truely on the other foot and I am enjoying it.

William R

Apparently we have both "missed the point", whatever that might have been.

R. Williams

I thought you'd like to make some 'easy money'.

Please explain, Dave

Well, we are all waiting for the "great man" to speak. He is usually quite outspoken and vocal so why the silence here?

Simple Sid

Does anyone know the process of creating a vote of no confidence in COC?

Ken

I am currently purchasing a new van and the price locally against a mainland supplier are below...I bet you can guess which route I am going down and that includes me paying the GST.

BUY LOCAL (NO CHANCE)

Local Price

New Fiat Ducato Freezer van

Price £30,819.38

GST £ 1,536.59

VED £ 551.00

Total £32,819.38

UK Supplier

New Fiat Ducato Freezer van

Price £19,310.85

Road Fund £ 270.00

GST £ 965.50

VED £ 551.00

Total £21,096.85

John

Thanks Ken, I am looking to buy my next car from the UK and I apprciate your help

Rosh

We are a local business and we know what all of our suppliers suggest as a UK retail price for each item. We then remove the VAT and then add the GST. We always have.

Many are suggesting that Jersey retailers are ripping customers off, which is unfair to many hard working small local businesses who do nothing of the sort.

Also, there is a misconception that retail owners are somehow well off financially. Some maybe well off, but most are struggling to make ends meet, with families to support, mortgages to pay etc., in fact no different to most local residents. I put in many more hours into my business than I should because of my circumstances, working on days off and evenings where necessary.

Small retailers also have difficulty competing with multi national chains as often the high volume of wholesale purchases from the same supplier by the large firm gets much better cost prices than the small independent who doesn't enjoy that level of discounts.

Internet companies can remove the VAT when sending to customers in Jersey and if we send items to UK customers they are in danger of being charged the VAT by HMRC (plus admin fee). I have no choice in paying GST to the States as it is a legal requirement for businesses with a turnover in excess of £300,000 (that is turnover, not profit). When GST was first introduced we tried to absorb it and we made a loss for the first time in our trading history. Increasing the tax to 5% has made things worse.

Some people have urged others to boycott retailers who are members of the Chamber of Commerce which is truly unfair to local retailers who are fair to the local customer. Many quote VAT charges by 'local' retailers, but in fact should differentiate between UK or overseas companies operating in Jersey who keep their VAT on and locally owned companies who do not charge the VAT.

When working out my retail prices I take a lot of time and care to calculate correctly based on what the supplier charges me.

I

R. Williams

You will never convince a large proportion of the trolls on this thread, despite the clarity of detail in your post.

Most just listen to what the local uninformed bigmouth spouts and take it as being true without giving it any thought.

Fran

But how do you define troll? I would generally define it as someone who places a remark with the intention of either derailing a discussion or of causing annoyance to another commentator.

Others of weaker intellect misuse the term to denigrate the comments of other persons with whose opinions they do not agree.

Having looked at the above comments, I cannot see any comments which fall into the first category, namely those placed with the intention of either derailing a discussion or causing annoyance to another commentator. There are no such posts.

That leaves the second, misused category, namely comments which express an opinion with which you do not agree.

It is not for me to say whether or not your are misusing the term, "troll" in order to set aside or otherwise attempt to stifle the opinion of others. That must remain a matter for your conscience. Others might, having taken in the evidence, take a less charitable view.

Mario

Well hare are a few points I would like to raise Rosh.

What about the ones who aren't fair? What do you propose doing about these? Should they be boycotted?

VAT has been charged down the years by some local businesses as it has mysteriously equaled the import costs, even when VAT was altered from 17.5% to 15%, then back up to 17.5%, before now being 20%. There is no way that VAT equals import costs for most if not all imports.

I won't buy from any of Mr.Warr's shops as I do not like his attitude.

As regards GST which is regressive, people will always look for ways not to pay it, just like UK customers did, with regard to VAT, when the fulfillment industry was in operation. LVCR was taken away because the UK government got fed up losing tax income and UK businesses were going to the wall. Maybe if it had kept more low key local businesses would still be able to access it. Local businesses now all suffer because of this change, who's fault is that?

I ask the obvious question, in the times of the worst recession since the 1930's, when wages are at best standing still, and at worst going south for the vast majority. Who has money to spend on overpriced goods when you can get big discounts and often better service from the click of a few buttons? I for one will never spending locally wherever possible due to past experiences of paying over the odds, when I had no option but to. I do not forget!

I have no doubt some will try and rebuff these valid points. However if they do, and they themselves buy online they are two faced.

James

GST was one part of a four point plan which overall is not regressive. The impact of Twenty Means Twenty has been huge but seems to have passed more quietly in the night, because there are a lot of small minded people out there who believe that it is for everyone else to pay for public services and not them. Their sense of society and community spirit is to do nothing, pay nothing, and criticise those who have succeeded in life and already pay the lion's share of States' expenditure. Imagine if everyone on the island was like that - no schools, no hospitals, no police, no fire brigade, no social services, no income benefit - because everybody thought that they shouldn't pay a bit of tax. Well, thank goodness for GST - the wealthier pay more tax, the poorer pay less tax, but everybody pays something.

Mario

Sorry James GST is regressive as it penalises the poorer in society the most. A rich person can live on the same food as a poor person however their income is vastly superior. As a percentage of their income it pales into insignificance.

Also not all the rich waste their money, I know some who are so tight that they could show the rest a thing or two.

As far as I am concerned those with the largest shoulders should take the greater burden and not pass it down the line via clever accounting.

I would be quite happy to pay 20% tax when I see all the rich pay 20% of their income. Indeed if the richest group paid more then everyone else's tax would fall. What could be fairer than that?

James Wiley

Why do you assume that there would be no schools, hospitals or other public services if there was no tax?

There may not be any government provision, but there would still be provision of those services.

You would more than likely find that those same services would be provided at a fraction of the cost and would be far higher quality without the interference of civil servants.

It is fundamentally because of the Jersey government that everything in Jersey is so expensive.

They provide the worst service and at the highest cost - no one would choose to be their customer but they can force us.

?

As usual Wiley you make zero sense.

What will pay for the schools, police, hospital, road works, street lighting etc etc etc if not tax?!?!

Clearly you live in cloud cuckoo land, perhaps its all those special ladies in your life distracting you.

LOL

Keep Smiling.

x

James Wiley

The same people who pay for them now, (we would).

We would though not have to pay for the largely ineffective and overly-costly bureaucracy which we are forced to support under the current system.

The Parishes are more than capable of handling street lighting and road maintenance and policing.

We do not need the States of Jersey at all.

Clearly you are one of the indoctrinated sheeple who believes that only government can provide.

I believe that everyone is more than capable of looking after themselves.

If not well then that is just survival of the fittest.

So?

I'm sorry, you may be an honest local retailer (if so, about the only one left) but there is no way you can say the majority of local retailers are honest, as the dozens of posts on here attest to!

Afraid you sound like the typical "woe is me" local Jersey retailer.

You say you put in many more hours into your business than you should and work on your days off and evenings... Yeah... So what? Forgive me if i'm wrong (i'm not), but isn't that what you're SUPPOSED to do if you're trying to make your business succeed?

You see that statement has just made it sound like you can't understand why you have to work hard to earn a living, its the usual local retailer mentality (of which Mr Warr is one of the biggest offenders). Just because you have opened a shop in Jersey does not mean you are entitled to do well!

It use to mean that, but thankfully the residents of Jersey are no longer held to ransom by local retailers, we now have choice, the internet and thats Mr Warrs (and other local retailers) problem, the old local retailer maxim no longer applies

"well if you don't buy it from me theres no one else who sells it"... There is now and boy are you lot crying.

Hate to tell you this, to be honest can't believe you havn't managed to work this out for yourselves, but the high street shop is dead! Not just in Jersey, everywhere, whether you like it or not the world has moved on. Let me give you an example when was the last time you saw a blacksmith on the high street... Exactly, they are no longer required and neither now is the rest of the high street shops, of course the more successful/competitive will survive but the majority... Well, goodbye.

Keep Smiling.

Love & Hugs.

x

Don

The issue is that if a local retailer has to work all hours, earn very little and finally run the risk of going bust, then no-ones going to do that.

A retailer will want to have a profit of £25,000 plus or theres no piont going into buisness.

James Wiley

True,

Income support for a family with two children is over £500 per week so actually it has to be more like £35,000 to make it worth an entrepreneur's while.

But clearly they deserve to earn more than a civil servant (or other non-productive member of society) so it has to be more like £50,000.

There are not enough people in Jersey to generate that kind of profit.

Mr Warr Hope you're reading this

Can't wait to buy lovely fresh coffee from the Internet!! I'll pop in & let you know how much cheaper it is. Oh dear Mr Warr you've done it now I bet you were stamping up and down in your shop I do hope you have read all theses postings.May help to make a better decision before you open mouth before switching brain on

Should be ashamed of yourself attacking low income earner's all the time- goodbye business.

Si

So typical, take the option that causes more pain to the consumer and gives no hassle to the retailer.

Why don't retailers start adding value by giving good service, being resourceful, helping their customer? The answer is laziness and lack of creativity.

It is better to make less profit and weather the storm than to up your prices so much your customers disappear altogether!

S G

Si, I totally agree.

My mother Used to have a working man's restaurant and it was always full, the reason being the food was good and plenty of it, Also she kept her prices down,which at the end of the day you make more profit because you have more contented customers.

TEA! FOR "V"endetta*

I applaud the people of this island,for standing up to this "upstart" of a person.

Time for a revolution to deal with all the other stuffed shirts of society to.

Anyway! "Car-fee" is for Americans,& there as popular as Warr.

How about some nice tea houses?

Now that coffee is "sunk".

adder

what we need is one giant shop that sells everything, like walmart usa,, and no smaller shops, small shops closing is good buisness.one really big store with lots of parking cafes crech bars parking cheap goods designer clothes cars motorbikes every you can think of then jersey will bounce back

adder

like fortregent shopping mall.cheaper rent

I Pasdenom

I agree with Mr Warr that items bought on the internet and delivered from outside the island should be taxed, but not to protect the local retailers.

Protecting retail businesses is not what GST is for, it to raise taxes to pay for local State provided services.

If we accept that 5% GST is the appropriate level of taxation on locally bought goods, then we should look at the cost to the tax revenues of importing these goods.

If the cost of businesses locally closing and greater burden being put on the State funded services as a result, then the answer is not to tax import at 5%, but far higher.

People are right that things bought online are often far cheaper, but this is not (necessarily) the fault of the local retailer; it’s just the economies of scale.

Tax imports at, say, 50% and people might still choose to buy online (nothing wrong with that) local stores may still close (a shame, but that’s business) but tax revenues, and what they fund aren’t materially effected.

Taxes should be set to pay for the required services or to penalize the consumption of or activity that is detrimental financially or otherwise; NOT to protect businesses that can't or won't compete on an even playing field.

J G

Betcha bottom dollar he will want to ban £1 shops next!

Hatty

Only if they sell coffee

martin

Well to be honest Mr Warr should look at the reason why people shop on-line, and he will find its Greed which is cancer that has grown over the years in Jersey. Shops charge allot more than the UK because most of the rents in town are very very expensive, now who owns most of the rents may I ask states mmmmm. We also pay VAT pluss GST on most of the good s when forgive me but Jersey is meant to be VAT exempt.

I like most people in the world are just getting by each month and I feel that the states yes the states don't live in the real world come out with pathetic articles like Mr Warr without taking the time to look into the real problem. Jersey is one of the most expensive place s to live in the british isles and sorry but wages don't match the cost of living so people have to look for bargins which on-line does.

Mr Warr and the rest of the states members do something that might make people think more of you and listen to what we are saying and for once in your lives act on it

Rant over

noah

I am like you Martin

I like most people in the world..........

Mario

martin a good question to ask is who are these businesses who pay low wages? If they upped their wages their employees might be in a better position to buy locally. However this would go against the capitalistic ethos of making as much money as you can.

Mind you I think a better business model would be to sell items at just above cost and sell lots and still have a long term business future. Or you could adopt the local approach of some of buy low (from the likes of Amazon) and retail out at plus 50-200%! Punters have cut out the middleman and who can blame them! You aren't even guarenteed a good grade of service for your extra pounds!

Sorry but retail is going the way of the corner shop of the 1970's taken out by supermarkets.

A question for Mr.Warr how much per hour does he pay his staff? It would be interesting to know if it is minimum wage, a little above it or something like £10 per hour which is what I would expect the minimum wage to be set at in Jersey due excessively high costs. Over to you Mr.Warr.

James

Funny, Jersey cries out for entrepreneurs to build new businesses, take those risks, yes mortgage yourself to the hilt and work 14 hours a day for three years plus to establish something successful that will benefit yourself and the community, because you are incentivised by reward at the end of it all.

Mario would like to make the life of entrepreneurs easier by......raising the minimum wage to a tenner an hour.

Mario

How much risk is there in setting up a limited company? If it fails do you lose your house and all your assets? No you don't. A few pounds spent can turn into millions. I don't classify this as much of a risk at all.

As for setting up a business it isn't generally for the good of the community it is for the good of the person taking said "risk". The byproduct might be a few/more jobs paying minimum wage in some cases. Are these the sort of businesses we want in Jersey?

As far as I am concerned entreprenneurs are given all possible assistance to succeed whether through state aid/tax breaks, protect from loss of all assets (limited liability), access to a flood of labour thus driving down wages. What more can be done to help them? Get the government to pay their wage bill for them?

Anyway many set up their own businesses so that they themselves aren't made use of by others. This is a big incentive to break free of the treadmill and get some control in one's life for many entreprenneurs. They can then get people to work for them and make them rich instead of the other way around.

James Wiley

Err yes usually you do lose everything Mario, because most people put everything into building a business.

All it means is that if it does all go wrong then your debt is cancelled and you can then start again from nothing.

I also think there is a big incentive just to do nothing and take the income support money or better yet work for the government which is like being on income support in that you don't have anything important to do and you don't have to worry about anything because the government will just raise a new tax but the pay is better.

Why do you think the world is in the mess it is in, because governments have been encouraging indolence for decades.

James

Never mind not ever having run your own business Mario, have you even met someone who has? You are so far off the mark, so lacking in understanding, perhaps even bitter that so many people are out there trying to better themselves and (as a by product) give us all a future whilst you nestle on your couch - in a nutshell, absolutely clueless!!

James

In the real world, at least the real Jersey world, there is affluence, and that is why prices are what they are - because up until now people have been prepared to pay them. Forget GST, cost of transport, high rents blah blah blah, it is simply because there are enough people with enough money to pay the prices.

What we are seeing is a seismic shift in the balance between supply and demand because of the internet. More and more people - even affluent ones - are baulking about paying Jersey Prices, particularly when there are so many service issues (as listed on this blog).

We are living through a period of fundamental structural change in the consumer market and need to recognise it as such. Where will we land? Hard or soft? Need a brainy person to answer that one.

Picky

I am not surprised that local business are going down the pan. We recently needed a part for a vacuum cleaner that was only a few months old. The part was only going to cost a couple of quid and would take me 5 minutes to fit so instead of going through the grief of trying to get the part done under guarantee I sent the wife to the powerhouse to get a part while I stripped the machine.

20 minutes later she came back fuming , not only did they not have the part, they refused to order one. When the wife enquirer why, she was told that they only wanted to sell the premium goods and not get involved in parts. How can you advertise that you sell a certain brand and have no interest in keeping it working.

Needless to say 2 minutes on amazon and a replacement part was winging its way to us free p&p

Grifter

Sorry Picky, no supplier should give a customer a part to fit whilst the product is under warranty. Not only will it invalidate the Warranty but it could also leave them open to litigation if it is incorrectly fitted/used thereafter.

William

You are not correct.

The warranty may or not be "invalidated" by a consumer tampering with the item, but, as a so-called warranty, it stands alongside and in addition to existing rights, namely that the goods are of satisfactory quality and are fit for purpose.

Unfortunately, many retailers seek to hide behind the warranty to limit these rights, which are far more important. It is entirely possible to seek redress even where an item is out of warranty.

The second thing which is incorrect within your commetary lies with your assertion with regard to possible litigation.

A supplier of parts will not be open to any risk of litigation where an end user might misuse any parts which are sold by that retailer. From a contractual point of view, the doctrine of remoteness of damages would preclude such a thing. In addition, the law of tort would also preclude any action for the same reason and also because of a lack of causation.

As a side issue, if what you say is true, then motor parts outlets and any other place where spare parts are sold would not continue to exist.

L.Beagle

William has it correct.

An item that fails within a short period, and this may be up to 6 months, means that it is generally regarded as not have been of merchantable quality at the point of sale. In such a case, the local retailer is liable and should replace the product. The manufacturer's warranty is a back up which could be enforced if the retailer is no longer operating.

Unfortunately most local retailers do not understand this and attempt to palm off customers to the manufacturer direct when an item fails. Might as well in this scenario have bought from another cheaper provider as there remains no variance in service levels.

Picky

It's not that we said the appliance was still under warranty to the retailer it was there attitude. They only want to make maximum profit by selling the appliance instead of supplying parts as well. I am a technician working on things considerably more complicated than a vacuum cleaner. The fact that changing the drive belt is mentioned in the manufacturers instructions should mean any owner could and should be able to change it. So why not stock the few user replaceable parts or consumables needed for the appliance.

In my field I can honestly say that I order a lot of equipment and materials from the uk. How can I be competitive if the local merchant wants to charge me £76 for a component but I can get the same part for £9 free p&p . 700% mark up is takin the P I couldn't sleep at night if I then put a percentage on the parts at that price

kermit

Around 50 people have lost their jobs this evening in Jersey as more than seven stores shut up shop.

The Collections Group are one of the island's largest fashion retailers and include the Axel chain, Freedom, Quicksilver, SDS, and outlets in De Gruchy's and Voisins. They've now all been forced to close.

Keep things the way they are and this will keep happening. Give money to Amazon instead of giving it to your neighbor, cousin, friends and so on is not helping...

The money that you are saving by going online is going to be spent one way or another in a form of tax to support the ones on benefits.

I am not better than anybody else, I shop online, but you have to think about action and reaction. Spending your money abroad is not helping. Import tax in some countries is there for a reason, keep the money in the country.

Gino Risoli

Darius,

Hope you feel better for that. You are very right about government spending. They cannot get enough of our money and the waste is difficult to stop.

Fanny By Gaslight*

These chat forums are becoming a "free" advertisement sight for Darius pearce, Nigel pearce & so on.

I have never seen so much "self promotion" being constantly quacked on here.

For the record,as Mr Pearce has so much to say,i have found a gents Pulsar chronograph watch in your shop with ionised plateing for £91 pounds.

An identical one "online" £76.99.

So lets have less of the self congratulation!

Tobias

In all fairness Fanny, Nigel Pearce & Sons are one of the very few remaining local shops that I still frequent, as they still retain "old-fashioned" values such as quality, customer service and value for money. I've never encountered unprofessional, disinterested staff in his shop; perhaps Mr Warr could take a few lessons from the Pearce family.

For the record, I am neither related to the Pearces, nor will I earn any sort of commission for this blatant advertisement! :-)

Darius Pearce

I cannot be the cheapest, on everything, at all times, sometimes other businesses get into trouble and dump products at very low prices (for less than they paid for them). It is just a sign of the dire economic situation that we are in.

Manufacturer's are fast closing accounts down and the easiest way to lose your account is to price gouge, but needs must as the devil drives so if a business has a choice of sell at a loss or go under, then they are going to sell at a loss.

Come into the shop with the printout and ask me to beat the price, then I may be able to do so - the manufacturer only checks the internet price and the price in the window, but I cannot advertise prices below a certain point and expect a continuity of supply of goods.

Jsyboy

I buy lots online for good reason. More choice, more convenient and much cheaper. Some of the mark up in Jersey is absurd. Clothes epecially. I have seen polo shirts for a quarter of the price online by way of one example. De Gruchy menswear are the worst offenders from what I have seen. The local retailers had it all their own way before the internet, not so now so they need to sell what people want at the right price. Even in the local sales you still finder cheaper online.

Anon

David Warr, I'll use the power of song to say what I have to say to you:

Hall and Oates - Out Of Touch

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ig0NVMVdmoA

Also, a Shakesperian question for the Chamber of Commerce. "Who will rid me of this meddlesome coffee merchant?"

Time for him to go. If he hadn't very publicly poked George Osborne in the ribs over LVCR, we might have been able to negotiate.

More trouble than he is worth.

sporran

Yes, questioning Osborne about LVCR at a British chamber convention , of all places, was a spectacular own goal, even by Mr Warr 's standards!

Jonoro

Silly Mr Warr

Has he thought this through? I suggest clearly not.

So if there is going to be GST on ALL imports, i.e. no de minimus figure then ALL letters received here from outside the Island for instance will have to be intercepted and GST paid on the paper and envelope that is being "imported".

Art Lelai

What I don't understand is why everyone is so happy to accept such shockingly high prices for our government services combined with shockingly inferior quality of customer service.

Civil Servants are so ill informed that you have to tell them what the law is, the minute you disagree with them they point to the sign that says 'we don't accept bullying' and walk away.

Such service would never be found in a shop.

The only reason they have any customers is because we are forced under threat of harm to our financial well being or incarceration.

Government is the major problem in Jersey, it is there fault that prices are so high because retailers have to work within their rules and they make everything so expensive.

Let's unite and turn on the real villains of the piece Ozouf and his cronies

adder

i agree. look at the damage he is doing now another 50 unemployed becouse of his stupid comments

JerseyRich

When I can buy a camera bag online for £80 cheaper, there is no reason why I should use the High street in Jersey. This is only one item where I have saved a lot of money. I know people bang on about how the poor businesses are suffering, but I am not going to put money into someone else's pocket if I am going to come off worse.

There are plenty of people that live from week to week, so why shouldn't people find a cheaper way to shop

VicMel

Online shopping will only increase...

Rumour has it.....

That all of Sir Philip Greens shops (TopShop, TopMan, Miss Selfridge, Dorothy Perkins, Burtons) - will all be moving into his flagship BHS stores.

New Look wont be renewing their lease in May.

King Street will be 25% empty by the summer - this will have to drive rents down - significantly maybe by 50% or more in time.

GST revenue will drop and GST will have to rise to 7.5% and then 10%.

The cost of living here is already above the UK. For the self employed income tax is similar (20% + Social Security @ 12.5%)

We have little tourism or agriculture that employes the indigenous population. Finance is faltering and under constant attack. The cost of running the Island, its infrastructure and unemployed will soon not be able to be met.

Its no longer time for a few quick fixes - this is almost a flat spin and without something very significant happening we will be a part of Hampshire before long, so that the UK & Europe can bail us out.

Andre

I wondered whether this would happen when Dorothy Perkins suddenly appeared in our BHS a while back. Certainly the rental paid on all the other stores must be enormous. Note too that Mothercare are 're-negotiating' all their rentals on their stores, and have threatened to close any stores where the landlord won't agree. It looks like the big guys are taking on the big landlords, who have milked the High Street like a cash cow for decades. It was the big chains who drove up shop rentals in the past as they had the finacial clout to pay them. It is the cost of the rentals which is now often quoted as one of the reasons for chains failing. In the 80's many companies such as Woolworths SOLD all their stores (which they owned), on a leaseback arrangement. Profitable in the short term, but a massive liability a couple of decades later. That sort of arrangement has come back to haunt the High Street.

I think it a shame that people are all labelling local stores as 'greedy', without considering the anonymous landlords who are making such a fat profit out of those same shops. I used to work part time in a local menswear shop. It was profitable, with a good customer base. Then the property sold, and the rent virtually doubled. And then it went up again, and again... The business closed, not because it wasn't any good, but it ceased to be worth my boss getting out of bed to open it.

If you are right about Philip Green's shops, then what we are seeing is a significant market reaction against over inflated shop rentals. This is a UK wide thing, but is particularly pertinent to this overpriced bit of rock. It isn't just about the internet. There seems to be a background battle starting to drop High Street rentals. In the long term lower shop rentals could be the biggest shot in the arm for the traditional High Street. It would allow specialist local shops to become viable. But I don't expect it to happen quickly, and in the meantime we will have to get used to empty shops.

Rosh

I was merely poiting out that there are honest retailers in Jersey and those that are fair to their customers. I put in the hours because I love my business. I certainly am not, nor ever would, ask people to feel sorry for me. I find your interpretation of my comments unfortunate.

I run a successful local business, because we are fair and honest traders, and the time I put in makes it successful. I am happy to work as hard as it takes. My pricing structure has been proven to be competitive locally and against internet traders.

You also state that Jersey residents are "no longer held to ransom by local retailers", well I am also a Jersey resident, who pays my taxes, rates, mortgage etc and I have never profiteered as many suggest the 'Jersey retailer' does.

Oh and for your information, I understand fully what it is like to put a full days work in and do not believe anyone owes me a living.

James Wiley

Sadly many people confuse the 'Jersey retailer' - with the likes of Tom Scott, Sandpiper, the CI Co-op etc. who have been at the forefront of rising prices in Jersey.

What I don't understand is who owns all the money the CI Co-op has, is it the shareholders?

They make an inordinate profit for such a comparatively small organisation, some of which could be given back by restoring the old 5% dividend (10% on double divi day) or perhaps even putting it up to 10% (20% on double divi day).

There is clearly the margin for them to do this.

Perhaps we shareholders need to turn up to the next AGM and demand they put the prices down or the dividend up.

Rog3r

Nice to hear that one local business can move with the times - perhaps rosh can provide some consultancy and sharing of methods with the chamber of commerce. They certainly seem to need it. The good ol' game of 'fleece the local' has come to an end.

Some people are born to be leaders, but a pencil must be lead.

Thesixthsense

It's so easy.....Advert in tonight's edition...carbon monoxide detector £32+ from local supplier....£18.50 elsewhere and £22 from Amazon....is it right! should it be 50% more expensive...????

truthseeker

The thing about the 'Ratner moment' is that it can't be taken back....the damage is done,David Warr will I am sure rue the day he showed his hand and tried to deny value for money to the hard pressed working people of this island,Imagine manipulating the law to fill your own pocket..all done under the auspices of Chamber ...whose name and validity he has now besmirched...that erring member the tongue, is nought but the servant of the mind..one that is pre occupied it seems with self interest.